Warped Dive World Evolution - BP/W Subgroup Mindset

[Divingaddict]

Diving should be fun. Use whatever gear that can make that a reality for you personally, not what makes it a reality for someone else.

 

[Kern]

With respect to dive gear, what else matters except emotional needs & bias?

There are two primary reasons why people purchase diving equipment ... initially it's because someone else told them it was what they wanted, and when that gets replaced it's usually with something else they tried and decided they liked better.

Rarely does someone purchase diving equipment based on some scientific comparison of performance ... mostly it's because it (a) has the features they wanted, or (b) they got a good deal on the purchase price.

Ultimately, the best equipment for any given diver has to meet three criteria ...

- It needs to be appropriate to the type of diving you do (for recreational diving, this can be pretty much any choice of equipment)

- It needs to fit you properly (i.e. BCDs and exposure equipment)

- It needs to fit your budget

Beyond that, it's all about emotional needs and bias ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

I fail to see where these comments, based on a quote taken out of context, has anything to do with the current discussion on the scientific method, versus anecdotal evidence.

I don't proselytise dive gear, what people use & their reasons for making that choice are entirely their concern.

But let me ask you a question or two. Do you dive a steel BP to satisfy your emotional needs & biases, or for other reasons. If you were in the market for a DPV, would you take the Tahoe Bench Mark Scooter Tests mentioned by Tobin into consideration, or would you just listen to some anecdotes.

Dive manufacturers do busyness not science, so there would be precious few scientific comparisons to choose between. I'v seen quite a few people chose things like wet suits based on pseudo scientific nonsense however.

 

[Jax]

I fail to see where these comments, based on a quote taken out of context, has anything to do with the discussion on the scientific method, versus anecdotal evidence.

But let me ask you a question, do you dive a steel BP to satisfy your emotional needs & biases, or for other reasons. If you were in the market for a DPV, would you take the Tahoe Bench Mark Scooter Tests mentioned by Tobin into consideration, or would you just listen to some anecdotes.

Bob brings up a good point. Many people choose what they do based on what appeals . . . for whatever reason. For some people, if they have stats that say it's great, that appeals to them. For others, the anecdotal evidence is seen as reputation and therefore appeals.

Once people make that decision, however, they tend to be very good at defending their choice as 'better' by touting the statistics they like, the things they've heard, or their own experience. When someone puts down another's experience, it becomes a personal attack on that person.

Now, add on that the unfortunately prevalent tendency of people to blow up their own ego by denigrating others and others' choices, the mix gets ugly.

Some people make choices not by trying gear, but by canvasing many people to make their choice. However, when they finally make their choice, it may be no more analytical than, "I want that one."

 

[Kern]

Bob brings up a good point. Many people choose what they do based on what appeals . . . for whatever reason. For some people, if they have stats that say it's great, that appeals to them. For others, the anecdotal evidence is seen as reputation and therefore appeals.

Once people make that decision, however, they tend to be very good at defending their choice as 'better' by touting the statistics they like, the things they've heard, or their own experience. When someone puts down another's experience, it becomes a personal attack on that person.

Now, add on that the unfortunately prevalent tendency of people to blow up their own ego by denigrating others and others' choices, the mix gets ugly.

Some people make choices not by trying gear, but by canvasing many people to make their choice. However, when they finally make their choice, it may be no more analytical than, "I want that one."

Jax, I don't really disagree with what you or Bob have said.

Once again though, it's based on a sentence taken out of context, about a different discussion entirely.

PS. There's no such thing as anecdotal evidence. The phrase anecdotal evidence is an oxymoron. Evidence is evidence, anecdotes are stories.

 

[EastTNDiver]

Jax, I don't really disagree with what you or Bob have said.

Once again though, it's based on a sentence taken out of context, about a different discussion entirely.

PS. There's no such thing as anecdotal evidence. The phrase anecdotal evidence is an oxymoron. Evidence is evidence, anecdotes are stories.

I think you're confusing evidence with proof. Evidence comes in many forms, including testimony from witnesses...i.e. anecdotes...i.e. stories.

 

[Kern]

I think you're confusing evidence with proof. Evidence comes in many forms, including testimony from witnesses...i.e. anecdotes...i.e. stories.

evidence |ˈɛvɪd(&#601ns|
noun
the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid. :mooner:

 

[adurso]

There is a reason dive gear is modeled by, well, models, and not representatives of those using the gear...same tactic as any advertising.

If the bulk of purchasers could be persuaded by tests; testing would be done, as it stands, people buy what they think looks good on them, or what they subconsciously identify with.....

 

[EastTNDiver]

evidence |ˈɛvɪd(&#601ns|
noun
the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid. :mooner:

Ok...I'll play...

ev·i·dencenoun, verb, -denced, -denc·ing.
–noun
1. that which tends to prove or disprove something; ground for belief; proof.
2. something that makes plain or clear; an indication or sign: His flushed look was visible evidence of his fever.
3. Law . data presented to a court or jury in proof of the facts in issue and which may include the testimony of witnesses, records, documents, or objects.

anecdotal evidence
Part of Speech: n
Definition: non-scientific observations or studies, which do not provide proof but may assist research efforts

:mooner: :tongue2:

 

[Potapko]

For years I have openly admitted my main agenda on SB; my dislike of sloppy, unsupported and ignorant typing!


I contend that I have mostly asked questions about and challenged sloppy, unsupported and ignorant typing with regards to much of the "advise" on ScubaBoard.

Don't you mean "advice" sorry, couldn't help myself

I am specifically interested in hearing from SB's BP/W proponents about why you first chose to go the BP/W route? As usual, I encourage everyone who cares to participate in this exchange of thoughts to share, ask questions, flame, criticize &/or rebut, however you please, but I will reiterate; I truly want to know why you chose to go the BP/W route?

I tried a bp/w because a tech diver i respected used one. On my very first dive I felt much more stable in the water. Felt like I was trimmed out better. Felt like I was more streamlined and felt like it was easier to move through the water.

That is why I bought my first bp/w and the 3 that followed it were bought because of my experience with the first one.

 

[Kern]

Ok...I'll play...

ev·i·dencenoun, verb, -denced, -denc·ing.
–noun
1. that which tends to prove or disprove something; ground for belief; proof.
2. something that makes plain or clear; an indication or sign: His flushed look was visible evidence of his fever.
3. Law . data presented to a court or jury in proof of the facts in issue and which may include the testimony of witnesses, records, documents, or objects.

I don't do law, I do science. :blinking:

anecdotal evidence
Part of Speech: n
Definition: non-scientific observations or studies, which do not provide proof but may assist research efforts

:mooner: :tongue2:

Must be something they do in the social sciences. Hmm, "social science" that'ed be an oxymoron too.