W-T-F?? part II

[Cave Diver]

Is that how you took my post? (just checking)

No, I don't think any (most?) of us in here have that attitude. But I do feel there are people out there that do.

I'm assuming you're referring to your post about the cornflakes? If so, I agree going through that is difficult to do with zero impact. But that doesnt mean we cant make efforts to minimize it by making sure gear is streamlined, our technique is good and it's not the first place a cave student is taken.

I guess the difference to me is that it seems some people take cave training just for the status and really don't give a damn about the caves at all. It's just a bunch of wet rocks, who cares if it get chipped, or broken? They don't appreciate the natural beauty (even though some us differ in our idea of "pretty" caves) or the time it took for them to form, or that the "rock" they just broke off is really a fossil that's been there for 1,000 years.

 

[The Chairman]

the "rock" they just broke off is really a fossil that's been there for 1,000 years.

Most of the limestone in Ocala is eocene (over 35,000,000 years ago) or oligocene (over 20,000,000 years ago). I'm afraid that if you want to see limestone that's only a 1,000 years old, you'll have to head to the Keys!

 

[lamont]

In open water. Maybe it was fortunate that when I learned to cave dive I lived 2000 miles from cave country. I spend many weekends in a lake running line and practicing my cave diving skills in 15-20 ffw. I ran line, practiced cylinder deployment and retrieval, no visibility line following, no mask line following, air shares, etc. While it's a different environment, it will improve your skills. And it doesn't damage the caves. How many divers take the time to do dives just focused on skills?

I agree you can do that to a point, but I don't really get better positional awareness of just how long I am in OW. There's a couple of restrictive areas in the upstream dos palmas line that myself and every other MX C1 diver I've talked to has worked on getting much better by going through. Everyone has gotten that immediate tactile feedback from the cave there by touching their fin tips to the cave. It isn't a terribly pretty section of cave, and its C1 limits, and i haven't found any better training in OW anywhere... By beating up that one small section of that one cave, I've avoided pounding the crap out of many other restrictions in prettier places...

And we are talking about fin tip brushing, possibly followed by touching a (heavily beat up) formation on the ground with a finger tip to pull through and reduce the damage -- we're *not* talking about leaving a full palm-print or jetfin imprint in the cave or ballistically imprinting a manifold in the ceiling and taking a couple pounds of cave out with you or something like that...

 

[JahJahwarrior]

You know, the only times I've had difficulty not leaving an impact in the cornflakes when I'm carrying multiple stages through while scootering at full speed.

I think there are too many cave instructors out there handing out cards. I know some of them. What do you tell them? It's sad.

 

[Dive-aholic]

You know, the only times I've had difficulty not leaving an impact in the cornflakes when I'm carrying multiple stages through while scootering at full speed.

Then why are you scootering full speed through there??

 

[ucfdiver]

You know, the only times I've had difficulty not leaving an impact in the cornflakes when I'm carrying multiple stages through while scootering at full speed.

I think there are too many cave instructors out there handing out cards. I know some of them. What do you tell them? It's sad.

We've got people asking for basic gear help one week, and then the very next week they're ready to start their instructor training and be done within a few months.

 

[The Chairman]

Even better was the dude asking where to take lessons and the next week telling us about getting plates off of the Doria!

 

[JahJahwarrior]

Then why are you scootering full speed through there??

I'm not But I'll honestly admit I have hit a tank on a rock a few times at Ginnie. Coming out the Lips is another place, though usually there if I hit anything it's my head. Benefit of diving SM, you are more likely to hit your head on the cave than your tanks. Nobody is perfect, if you can honestly tell me that you've never left a single mark in a cave, then I shall bow to your prowess. Until then, lets all work to get to the point that we don't leave marks.

 

[ucfdiver]

I'm not But I'll honestly admit I have hit a tank on a rock a few times at Ginnie. Coming out the Lips is another place, though usually there if I hit anything it's my head. Benefit of diving SM, you are more likely to hit your head on the cave than your tanks. Nobody is perfect, if you can honestly tell me that you've never left a single mark in a cave, then I shall bow to your prowess. Until then, lets all work to get to the point that we don't leave marks.

Not a single person on this forum can make it through the cornflakes on the way out with a stage and not touch anything. If they can, I'd love to see video.

However, scootering full speed on the way in without hitting anything is completely reasonable, and I think easier than swimming (because the scooter steers you quickly against flow).

 

[Dive-aholic]

I'm not But I'll honestly admit I have hit a tank on a rock a few times at Ginnie. Coming out the Lips is another place, though usually there if I hit anything it's my head. Benefit of diving SM, you are more likely to hit your head on the cave than your tanks. Nobody is perfect, if you can honestly tell me that you've never left a single mark in a cave, then I shall bow to your prowess. Until then, lets all work to get to the point that we don't leave marks.

I admit I've left marks, lately usually only in silty bottoms that will eventually erase themselves. Your statement above seemed to imply that your were scootering through full speed and contacting the cave. One of the things I like about the Magnus is I can drop it to speed 1 through smaller passage and then kick it back up to speed 2 or 3 through larger passage.