Valve Drill Logistics

[TSandM]

You can make a logical argument for isolating first, and you can make a logical argument for going for the most likely failure. Since nobody keeps statistics on what goes wrong in doubles setups, I don't think anybody really knows for sure what's most likely to happen, except that manifold failures are less common than regulator failures. (Thus arguing to start with a post.)

But here, I personally am going to be a sheep. DIR diving came out of caves, and I don't think anybody can argue that the WKPP doesn't have an enviable safety record for very extreme cave diving. If, in their experience, going for the right post first, and isolator next is the best sequence, I'm willing to follow it until or unless somebody provides me with some real data to show it's a bad choice, and not just an argument.

 

[lowridersvt]

I do not see the issue with with either way you do valve drill i can do both the gue and tdi/ntech valve drill in 30 sec i do not see a major advantage or doing it any specific way since what you see in the real diving world is far from a valve drill. The valve drill is a training tool For manipulating valves in the real world you asses the situation then act . Then let you team member check you out then dive over

I do believe than the shut down you isolator first is a solo diving idea to save half your gas

 

[texdiveguy]

I do believe than the shut down you isolator first is a solo diving idea to save half your gas

Yea that's right....it's a 'solo' diver thing---NOT!

 

[Steve R]

Yea that's right....it's a 'solo' diver thing---NOT!

Actually a lot of what he has to say about that makes sense.

It's pretty clear to me from reading a lot of posts here that the Iso first's main idea is to, well, isolate both tanks first, to ensure you have the maximum amount of gas in each individual tank regardless of the actual problem is, or possibly better said, until you figure out, what end is up.

If I was to start to dive solo again, that's how I'd probably approach it.

The "post first" crowd realizes that the most common problems in an uncommon problem to begin with are almost always 'post-related' issues which you will actually be better off hitting the problem first than waste time isolating first. Sure you could guess wrong, but training folks tells me they're pretty good at knowing which side is having the issue, way more often that not.

We also realize, and don't go running around panicing about being alone without gas,and that the "issue" here is most everyone thinks like a solo diver, even when they think they're buddy diving.

Not sure about you, but my buddy is caring my reserve gas to get me home, so when the highly unlikely event of gas loss happens, I work on dealing with the actual problem that will most often leave me with the most available gas anyway, in the minimal amount of time and valve turning.

Then again, if I were a solo diver I wouldn't think the way I do, MTL anyway.


BTW Alan, how many gas-loss sit's have you been in, in the last 2 years?



EDIT: Oh, and this has nothing to do with realizing that lowrider is from my home town....lol. Just realized who it was

 

[texdiveguy]

Steve R....has nothing to do with solo or team diving the concept of isolating first and R post second. I don't see any lines drawn between divers whom both dive solo and team or just team dive when it comes to isolating first.

I dive both formats often and will always isolate my gas supply first prior to hitting the R post...by which as stated before all happens in the same hand motion (from isolator right to the R post---simple/fast and effective).

I agree with you and again as I stated earlier it is a pretty rare issue to begin with---thats a 'good thing'!

I for one don't care to see this good thread turned into team vs solo or GUE/DIR methods are the best way to do things discussion.

All of us that dive doubles with isolators whether recreational or technical still face this issue all the same....it's plain to see as the threads OP stated there are several ways to approach the issue.

The bottom line is both methods have merit and will both work....its just indv. preference.



"BTW Alan, how many gas-loss sit's have you been in, in the last 2 years?"-Steve R

PS--Steve...just saw your post addition...I have not been in a gas-loose sit. over the past 2 years, neither have I gotten 'bent' ...thank GOD!

 

[do it easy]

One of my motivations for starting this thread was just to see if there were other alternatives. Thanks to all that contributed. I don't see this thread as a team vs solo thread, but I do think the issues roughly fall along those lines, simply because of the philosophies that each camp has.

I think TSandM hit the nail on the head- the real data aren't known. Either right post first or isolator first will work, although they each have strengths and weaknesses. There are good arguments for either procedure and I will probably lose sleep second guessing if I chose the best procedure for my diving. I would have no problem if I was asked to do either as SOP, although I prefer right post first.

I've had a few leaks- one was a sticky drysuit inflator and another was a leaking second stage on a deco bottle. These aren't exactly manifold/reg failures, but I was actually shocked at how obvious the problem was and how quickly I corrected them. I think most times, the failure will be obvious and this thread will just be an academic lesson to file away for a really bad day.

Ironically, I have a set of doubles in the garage right now that has two leaky burst disks. They are scheduled to be serviced soon, so I just use them around the house. I wouldn't be surprised if only one burst disk was leaking, but the fact that both are leaking boogles my mind- I service my manifolds yearly and dive in freshwater. The leaks aren't too bad but they are too much of a liability to use them.

 

[texdiveguy]

Ironically, I have a set of doubles in the garage right now that has two leaky burst disks. They are scheduled to be serviced soon, so I just use them around the house.

You diving at the house...?

 

[do it easy]

You diving at the house...?

Just cyber diving! They were in the kitchen earlier this week- I've been trying to get my omelettes really light and fluffy. They're also useful for drying tanks and other scuba parts.

 

[texdiveguy]

Just cyber diving! They were in the kitchen earlier this week- I've been trying to get my omelettes really light and fluffy. There also useful for drying tanks and other scuba parts.

Gotta love it,,.......thanks again for the thread!

 

[grazie42]

About unidentified leaks uw:
I´ve seen a ds inflator hose unscrew enough to bubble significantly, the diver couldn´t locate it...
Another had a 2nd stage unscrew from the hose, resulting in a bubblebath (on a single-rig)...
Both on a 1-week liveaboard...I just don´t think "unknown failiures" are that rare...

ymmv