Triple-L BC's and Products in general

[Rickg]

We charge a re-stocking fee just like every other business in the world does, if it is determined the customer is at fault for the return.

Jack,

I don't have any issue with a restocking fee. I guess my question for you is how do you determine if the customer is "at fault"? If a customer orders something that doesn't fit are they by default "at fault" because it doesn't fit?

For example, if after thoroughly studying all the available info on your website, I order a BCD that I think will fit me but it turns out that when I get it just doesn't fit the way I would like it does that mean I am at fault and will be charged the $35 restocking fee?\

Rickg

 

[Quetzal]

I have dealt with Jack on two separate purchases and both times his customer service has been exceptional. When there is an issue that the customer is not at fault, there is no stocking fee. I have confidence in their product because of Jack's customer service, and not the opposite.

I whole heartedly agree. I had a problem with a wetsuit and Jack did me right. If his response to my problem is any indication of their company I will be a lifelong customer!
He is one guy you can trust. Period. Probably like me doesn't like the bull**** or having his honesty and integrity questioned.
Allen

 

[jonesydive]

Hello All,

Been reading the post/speculation re: Triple L. They do, in fact, have great prices. I know personally someone who has bought a BCD and loves it. My boyfriend and I bought a wetsuit each. His fit, mine didn't. He loves his. Here is the thing....they boast an easy return policy, however, they did not deliver.

I did the live chat to find out how to return the wetsuit for an exchange. I was told as soon as I sent them my return shipping tracking number, the new suit would be mailed out (as in cross shipping). A week after I sent them the tracking number, no new wetsuit. I did the live chat again to find out what was up. The live chat operator, who is Jack Cummings the marketing director, was very rude to me.

They do charge a restocking fee which I new and accepted up front. They were also going to charge a repackaging fee because I did not ship back just as I had received (the orginal packaging had been in the garbage and I didn't thiink they wanted week old spaghetti on their wetsuit!) but they decided against it. I replied on the live chat that that was great (that they would waive the fee).

Jack Cummings read sarcasm into that response and proceeded to get very rude with me. So much so, that I decided to pay more money elsewhere and told him to keep his wetsuit.

After reading the posts on this site about the live chats, my experience and the experience of another friend, I REFUSE to buy any other product from this company.
Just wanted to let others know that as long as you don't care about customer service, then you may be ok saving a buck. I personally expect more from a company when it is my hard earned $.

 

[plankspanker]

It looks like I have dealt with you after all. I bought an Orion bc a few months ago, before they offered a crotch strap. When they started selling the crotch strap I sent an email asking if triple-l would make an exception to the minimum order (the strap was $3.50 and the minimum purchase is $35.00) based on the fact that I had ordered both the orion and a travel bag only a few months earlier. I think this was a fair question.

Here is the original email:

I recently ordered an Orion/laguna bag combo and at the time you did not offer a crotch strap. I would really like to get one but I don't need anything else and it doesn't meet the minimum purchase requirements. Would it be possible to make an exception to the minimum since I ordered something so recently?

thanks
H

Instead of just saying "no exceptions to the minimum order" and being done with it I got a reply from you that went like this:

"Dear H,

If you'll pay the freight and handling charges (which will be much more costly then the part itself) we'll send you a free crotch strap. This is why we have a minimum purchase requirement, because it not worth selling anything for less. All the profit goes in shipping and handling.

Best regards,

Jack Cummins"


I understood the policy and that is why I asked for an exception. Of course I assume that he is saying that he is waiving the minimum order of $35.00 and just sending me the $3.50 strap for whatever it costs to ship it. In my original email this is what I asked for, would they make an exception to the minimum order based on the fact I had ordered the Orion so recently.
When I ask how much the shipping charges were. I got this:


"Dear H,

Minimum charge = $35.00 + $12.50 S&H charge = $47.50.

Best regards,

Jack Cummins"

????
$47.50 for a crotch strap???, yeah, i'll get right on that.

Spare me the rant about "putting words in your mouth" I asked you to make an exception (key word asked, not demanded) and instead of just saying no you just added $35.00 to the order and thought I would go for it, which is just plain insulting.
In the end I didnt lose anything but at the same time my experience wasnt exactly a positive one either. Again, the issue wasnt that I didnt get what I asked for, it was the way I was told no.

He is one guy you can trust. Period. Allen

I am happy that you had a good experience but can you really say that with that much conviction only having dealt with him one time?

 

[CharleyT]

I too wish they had some policy on minimum orders. I purchased an Orion from a Triple-L customer who it did not fit, then ordered some other things from them (totally more than $35). Now, I'd love to have the crotch strap, as it looks like it would help with the "riding up" I have on occasion. Maybe if enough of us ask, someone at Triple-L will allow us to order a strap without having to make a $35 purchase. Being an Ebayer, I believe a strap would fit into the same $3.50 packing box I used to use to sell Disney Beanies and such.


Let me finish by stating that I do love the Orion. It works well for me, except as mentioned above. My hood works great, the extra Orion pockets I purchased are the right size, and, although I've not had to use it yet, the weight belt looks to be a nice product as well.

Charley

 

[Jack Cummins]

Look, we're in business to make a profit like anyone else. And it seems so easy to sit and write that a minimum charge should be waived for each individual when, what you fail to realise is, you are not alone. It costs the same amount of money to prepare to send a $3 product as it does a $300 product. Shipping and handling costs us money, fuel surcharges, a minimum shipping fee (Fedex doesn't have a fee for 0.2 ounce item, so we have to pay for a lb.), salaries, time expended, etc. And what about the c/c charges? It costs money to process these fees for both the seller AND customer. Anyway, to make along story short, Triple-L ends up spending approx. $20-$25 to sell you a $3.50 crotchstrap. So, you see we lose approx $20.00 each time we honor one of these requests. Now, multiply this by how many times we get this request each day from other customers and tell me if you would do business this way. As it is plain to see, Triple-L's prices are the lowest anywhere for as high a quality product as we manufacture (shameless, but true, plug!). Our profit margin is already at a minimum and we simply can't afford to do this. That's why companies have the minimum purchase rule not because they dreamed it up, but because of the reality of the situation. In as much as we would like to keep the customer happy we also want to remain in business so we can continue to offer these high quality, low priced items to all other present and potential customers.

 

[plankspanker]

Now, multiply this by how many times we get this request each day from other customers and tell me if you would do business this way.

so your solution to this problem is to answer the request of the customer, who asked to have the minimum charge waived, with a price quote that added the minimum charge of $35.00 to a $3.50 order? Were you really offering that as a viable choice? I would honestly like to know this. Why couldnt you just say "no, you have to order $35.00 worth, no exceptions" instead of asking me to just give you $35.00?
As I said, the issue wasn't that I didnt get what I asked for, it was the way I was told no.

 

[Jack Cummins]

OK, you win...

 

[Marek K]

How could you possibly know that the reply you got was 'terse'. Did you hear it? The reply was pretty straight forward and neutral. As you may know, there are a lot of people wanting to chat at the same time and the operator has to be brief, answer the questiona s quickly as possible and go on to the next customer.

Hi Jack--

Yes, I think it was you I was chatting with.

I just looked up "terse" in the dictionary, just to make sure I knew what it meant. "Free of superfluity; concise." It doesn't mean "rude." I stand by that.

My comment had nothing to do with the tone of your voice -- you're right, e-mail or chats can't convey tone, and that can be very dangerous that way.

I wasn't attacking you, I was just saying that I wasn't thrilled with the chat exchange. I was asking about how the BC was designed to fit with the unusual elastic, and you didn't address the question... you finally just said -- tersely

-- that I could return or exchange it if I wasn't satisfied.

I do understand that you have to deal with a lot of people, simultaneously, and be brief. But was really hoping for you to address what I was asking, and it didn't seem to me like you were real eager to do so.

As in all inter-personal communications, what's most important is not how something is meant... it's how it's perceived. And I hope I'm making myself clearer now.

I also, don't see anywhere within the quotation marks that anyone asked for a $35 restocking fee. Looks like something you assumed. If you're going to report on something, pls stay objective and don't be putting words in people's mouths or describing a sound you never heard.

You're right. You never said anything in the chat about the $35 restocking fee. I came to that conclusion after checking out your web site, and seeing that condition.

I wasn't exactly complaining about the fee... I just meant that, considering the price of the Stratos, it wouldn't be worth it to return it having to pay the fee plus shipping... I could easily recover my cost by selling the BC here privately.

Though, now that you bring it up, whose fault would it be if a customer carefully ordered a product according to the size chart on your website, then found the product is too large? I've seen at least a couple folks here who had that experience -- your BC products seem to run a bit large. I also carefully measured, and was just wondering whether the Stratos wasn't too large on me too. I was hoping to determine that from Triple-L, since I wasn't going to have the opportunity to dive the BC before the 14-day (now 7-day) return guarantee period ran out.

As it turns out, I took the Stratos to a local dive shop (!) here in Warsaw, Poland, where the guy was nice enough to look at it for me. He was very impressed of course with the quality for the money, and said that it looked fine size-wise. So I'm happy now.

Unlike jonesydive, I don't consider this experience as one that will keep me from dealing with Triple-L again. To the contrary, I just ordered and received a Stratos BC for my son. The quality, price, and shipping promptness are just too good.

I'm sorry, but it's just my perception of that after-purchase customer service...

--Marek

 

[Marek K]

Sorry, Jack, my error... I just re-checked your returns policy, and I may have misunderstood it. It says the $35 restocking fee applies to "all returns for refund if it is determined the return is the result of your error." It also says that RMAs must be requested within 15 days for refund... I could have sworn I saw just something about 7 days... might have been notice regarding damage.

None of this says anything about exchanges, though.

--Marek