Tipping....how much do you tip?

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I have not heard anyone mention Australia. When we were last in Australia we were asked by Aussies not to tip as they did not want tipping to become a part of their culture. We were asked not to tip at any restaurants either as the workers were making a living with the pay that they were receiving.
Again, when we were in Paupau we were asked again NOT to tip as their crew was making a living. I didn't listen to the talk and did tip 10%. They seemed grateful but I'm not sure that it was good to put my culture on them.
Last time we were on a boat in Hawaii the DM's turned off my air by mistake, he also made me come up with over 1300PSI left in my tank. There was no tip. I feel if I'm paying for a tank and diving, I think a one hour dive for each tank is not out of line. The amount of money spent should at least give me a minimum of of one hour underwater. I'm now using this as a gauge, no "one hour", no tip. I don't care if someone says we got to get back so come up after 45 minutes, this is ridiculous. I've spent my vacation flying to a far-away place, spent my hard earned money, so I can dive for less than one hour per tank....I don't think so! This is very inconsiderate of any DM. And this is where I'm drawing the line.

my2cents
 
Sorry didn't specify that I was refering to the restaurant business that takes a portion of the tips that they automatically charge, non the less the point I was trying to get out is that I prefer to hand the person cash that way I know that the person who did everything to make my experience (diving dining ect...) a memorable one gets the cash/tip. Maybe I am so pasionate about giving tips and those who don't because I know what it is like to get screwed over by a boss. At my last job we all got cost of living increases and never got a raise because we were doing what we were paid to do and that is why we got a salary, not matter how much you did that was in your job description and that is what your salary was for. It is really frustrating when your hard work is not appreciated, I ended up leaving that job after 5 years because my attitude towards hard work was going downhill. I worked harder than anyone else in my department and all I got was more work, never got any token of appreciation for my hard work until I quit at which point my manager singled me out as being the hardest worker he had ever seen (but it was too little to late)

How little you know! Most diving businesses are struggling for survival these days, which translates into the employees probably taking ALL the available "profit" with nothing at all left for the owner. Certainly where I operate I can think of virtually no dive business that survives on internally-generated income.
 
The amount of money spent should at least give me a minimum of of one hour underwater. I'm now using this as a gauge, no "one hour", no tip.

I assume that the DM calling the dive early due to weather, accident, or some other extraordinary condition doesn't count against him, right?

Also, it sounds like a "dive till you're empty" policy is best-secured by confirming with the operator up front that you won't be given crap for diving your own profile rather than being led on a DM-guided tour? Nobody likes it when an air hog forces everyone else to surface prematurely, but IME this is a policy that gets ironed out in the briefing.
 
On any given weekend from April-December we happily wake up at 3:30am on Saturday to check the marine forecast to determine if we should get out of bed at 4am to drive 50 miles to get to the boat at 5am, (Me, [not "happily"] too. Except getting up is no option; I have to show up at the boat to avoid losing my trip fee even if the trip is scrubbed. MY drive is more like 70+ miles if going to the Brielle area, 50 to Barnegat, where the Gypsy used to be.) picking up food, soft-drinks and ice on the way, so we can spend an hour getting the boat set up by 6am so that when you get there at 7am we can help you load your two sets of steel doubles, both your deco bottles, your giant tote box of gear, your wet/dry suit and two other bags of stuff on the boat so we can leave by 8am, securing your gear so it doesn't go in the drink, (When arriving 45-60 minutes before the scheduled departure I sometimes have to wait for the crew to arrive or to "open" the boat. Then I load and secure MY gear as do most other Jersey divers. And we paying pax also lend a hand with the other paying pax's gear when it's occasionally needed, like for the late arrival.) so we can get you to the wreck by 9am, spending the last half hour of the ride in the sweltering heat fully-geared up in a drysuit (As you get more experience you'll be better able to judge how long getting geared up takes and time yourself accordingly.), fighting back our own seasickness (With time, this too will pass, for most people.) so we're ready to jump into the 55F water as soon as the captain says "GO" so we can rocket down 130’ or so, solo, in the dark (Is this the same dark I'll be in?), fighting current (Same current, too?), while dragging 50lbs of shot/chain, and in low viz locate the safest spot to tie in to the wreck and set a strobe for you, as quickly as possible so you don't have to sit in the sweltering heat, fully geared-up, puking all over yourself. (I've helped set that hook a couple of times, and TIED IT IN AS WELL, when the boat actually required buddy diving and I got paired with a "DM." Setting the strobe shouldn't be too difficult. [If I remember I'll bring mine to the Gypsy next time I dive her and show you how simple it is.] And, just like every other diver, start gearing up when the cap says its time to, and sit around in the sweltering heat waiting for the set hook signal. BTW, that water is the same temperature for me as it is for you.) After potentially burning half our back-gas doing that, we’re often getting back up and out of the water while many passengers are still getting geared up. (After you get more experience your air consumption will decrease.) And while you’re doing your first dive we're hurrying out of our gear so we can hose down your puke (not MY puke), hang your gear line, straighten the boat up and put lunch and soft-drinks together (? - they used to just throw the subs in the fridge/cooler with the sodas) so that when you come up from your dive we can take your spear-gun/camera/catch bag, unclip your deco bottle, and safely get you and a dozen other divers in steel doubles out of the water, remove your fins, get you over to your seats, tanks bungied in, out of your gear, (If I'm one of the first divers back up I'll be helping you too. Just like any other diver who's already back on board.) stow your deco bottles, put your catch into the game cooler, serve lunch (things may have changed on the Gypsy since '05-they didn't "serve" lunch then), and do whatever else we can to make sure everyone is having a good time. During the surface interval we’ll help folks switch over their tanks if they want (DON'T TOUCH! This probably goes for most Jersey divers.), provide an o-ring to a passenger who needs one (I bring extras and have given them to pax)), pull an extra mask strap out of our own sav-a-dive kit (I bring extras and have given them to pax) for another diver, and maybe lend an extra layer of drysuit undies (never did that) to the diver that was really cold on the first dive. Over lunch we'll tell everyone where to find the 5lb lobster (standard SI talk) we didn’t have time to nab because we blew through 1,800psi (After you get more experience your air consumption will decrease.) on the tie in or maybe one of us will pull out a binder of deck plans to show you how to get into the best spot to find artifacts on a wreck sunk by a WWI or WWII U-boat. (Yeah, Jersey divers are known for their willingness to share good loot spots with strangers.) When everyone’s ready, we help get all the divers geared up again, pointing out un-connected drysuit inflator hoses (You'll find if you don't try to rush a diver most will complete their suiting up in their normal orderly manner. Just stand back and observe. Make "suggestions" only after the diver has completed his and overlooked something.), dunking masks in the rinse bucket (not mine), and getting everyone back in the water for dive number two. While everyone's under, we straighten the boat up and then sit around for an hour, wishing we were doing a second dive. (We often get to pass the time by unclogging one or both heads, cleaning the macerators, and putting them back together.) When divers start coming up we help everyone back out of the water, get out of their gear, and stow more lobsters/fish while one of us quickly gears-up to do a solo bounce-dive to 130ft, untie quickly, do a free ascent down current in the open ocean 20mi from shore while waiting for the 50' boat to do a “live” pick up while slamming up and down in 3-5's (the same 3-5's I was in?). (Depending on the charter and the needs of the passengers the crew member who unties is either the lucky one who gets to do TWO dives that day or the unlucky one for whom this is their ONLY dive of the day.) Out of the water and quickly get out of our gear so we can pull up 160’ of line, by hand (that is a buster; ALL boats should have a winch!), including 50lbs of shot/chain, get everything stowed, and get underway, so we can get you back to the dock quickly (while helping folks shuck scallops (THAT is worth a couple of bucks) and/or drag mussels on the way back in) so we can help you get your two sets of steel doubles, both deco bottles, giant tote box of gear and two other bags of stuff off the boat and into your car (Never seen that. INTO MY CAR. Wow! I'll have to put the Gypsy at the top of '08's to do list.) so you can leave to get home early while we spend another hour and a half cleaning up puke, fish guts, sediment, soda cans, lunch leftovers and other general grit and grime, re-fuel, close the boat up, and drive 50 miles home, typically making an extra stop by one dive shop or another to drop off the lost-and-found items passengers inevitably have left behind so they don’t have to drive 100 miles (140+ miles in my case. But wait, I don't leave stuff behind since I carry all my own gear and know what I brought with me and what I'm returning home with.) back and forth to the boat during the week to retrieve them. If there's no traffic (there always is in the summer (we know, we drive on the same roads) we can get home around 6pm, having spent $20 on gas/tolls (more like $25 for me in addition to the $30+ for air and the $85-$100 for the charter) and another $20 on tank fills, and having told the passenger we gave our own replacement mask strap to “not to worry about it.” After rinsing our gear and deciding whether to try to wash the puke and diesel out of our favorite t-shirt from Cozumel or just throw it away, we get to have dinner and go to bed early so we can get up at 3:30am on Sunday and do it all over again. (Does the Gypsy seem to attract an inordinate amount of diarheics, pukers, fish guts and diesel spills?)

A heartfelt thanks with a smile and handshake – with or without a few bucks – says “Dude, I really appreciate what you do!" (I hope the Gypsy owner heartfeelingly smiles at you and shakes your hand and, without a few bucks says, “Dude, I REALLY appreciate what you do!”)

Slinking off with no acknowledgement whatsoever – financial or otherwise – says “F--- you, you get to dive for free!” (I doubt the owner says that, at least as far as you know.)
BTW, RJP, I hope you realize I’m just poking fun here. You seem to have a sense of humor that can appreciate it.
 
The point that I’m trying to get across is that we in professions that pay well enough for us to live comfortably and enjoy vacations. The places we go for vacations are not the same as we are from and people are paid much less than we are, shouldn’t we share with them if they deserve it? I think that is the right thing to do. Most of these people make less or around $1/day to serve you, even a couple cents tip will make the difference to them, and the ones that are trained and are there should we need assistance in a live saving instance deserve more. I don’t know about you but if would always be indebt to someone who saves me and would go out of my way to make sure they know this. But even though they might not be in a situation to save your live every dive, I feel that you should still show your appreciation for them to be there just in case you need help.
 
I assume that the DM calling the dive early due to weather, accident, or some other extraordinary condition doesn't count against him, right?

Also, it sounds like a "dive till you're empty" policy is best-secured by confirming with the operator up front that you won't be given crap for diving your own profile rather than being led on a DM-guided tour? Nobody likes it when an air hog forces everyone else to surface prematurely, but IME this is a policy that gets ironed out in the briefing.

Yes, if they are calling a dive due to weather or current then so be it, but I'm not including those called because of air-hogs, newbies sucking down a tank, or because the DM wants to get to shore for: lunch, dinner, it's late in the day, the DM has a date or the movie starts in 20 minutes. I've heard plenty of excuses. Just think, I saved up all year to hear this excuse and I'm only going to one place per year on my dime and then I have to give up 15min. of precious dive time time for someone who thinks we should all be back within his/her time contraints. This is why we started going on liveaboards, but, I'm not always going to go on a liveabord, so I'm expecting at least one hour per tank...of course depth does become a factor...duh!
What is unfair about this? No hour/no tip?
 
When Im diving on others boats I try to set an example. "Thanks for the great dives, where is the tip jar?" Many just have no idea that they can or should tip even though there are often signs up on the boats (thats a whole new thread) saying tips are welcome.

I wish I'd thought of that on a recent trip to Coz. I couldn't believe we were the only ones who tipped upon leaving the boat. The DM and captain worked hard to give us a good trip out and point out lots of cool stuff. But, out of the 5 days we dived and approximately 20 different people we dived with, we were the only ones besides an elderly couple to tip. What a shame. No excuse for such greedy behavior.
 
I wish I'd thought of that on a recent trip to Coz. I couldn't believe we were the only ones who tipped upon leaving the boat. The DM and captain worked hard to give us a good trip out and point out lots of cool stuff. But, out of the 5 days we dived and approximately 20 different people we dived with, we were the only ones besides an elderly couple to tip. What a shame. No excuse for such greedy behavior.



But isnt that what you'd already Paid for? What exactly do you think the fee you've already paid Does cover? everything Except service?

Maybe some people on that boat got exactly what they Paid for.... a trip out... shown the sights... a trip back... with no additional, exceptional service and therefore no obligation to tip, I think its a bit of a generalization to label all those people as "shameless and greedy".

If an operation is disgruntled as to its earnings they need to either work harder providing individual attention or raise their base price.
 
I agree with alot in this thread that DMs and boat crew should earn a reasonable wage. I also agree that the tip should be for exceptional service:D, not for the non-service-oriented:shakehead:, money grubbing:shakehead:, guilt inducing:shakehead: dive bum Divemaster trying to survive on tips, because his boss is too cheap and inconsiderate to stand up and change the poor practice of allowing his crew to volunteer on his boat.

I have worked for an operator that (luckily) informed guests that tips are appreciated. I have also been on many boats where the captain, at the conclusion of his safety briefing at the dock, lets the divers know to "take care of the crew:11:."

I believe the DM's should be paid by the boat they are working on. Isn't it true a bad DM will make divers go elsewhere? Shouldn't the boat owner show some gratitude to a good DM that services the BOAT OWNER'S CUSTOMERS? Why does the boat owner (usually the captain) collect fees for a dozen divers, twice a day and not pay the DM for making all of the repeat business possible:confused:? Don't you agree... a bad experience with a DM will have you looking for a different boat next trip:confused:?


Haven't we learned anything reading all of these posts...

The days of old are gone... DIVING IS A PROFESSION!!!

Owners and operators STEP UP and start paying your PROFESSIONALS!!!

Charge the right price for your service and let's move into a new era of PROFESSIONAL DIVING!!!

It's what the customers deserve... IT"S WHAT THE PROS DESERVE!!!


Simple math for 2 tank trip se florida on a medium sized boat...

12 divers per trip @ $65pp (very reasonable) = $780 per trip

x 2 trips....................................................= $1560 per day

I figured this at the lower end of the boat-fee scale..... $1560 PER DAY

What would be so hard about paying a DM $100-150/day for busting his/her ass for 12 hours... regardless of weather, seas, butthole divers, etc...

I know there are alot of variable expenses season, weather, fuel, ins, boat pmt, etc...

Most boats this size go out with the captain (owner) and a DM.

Why isn't the professional DM being paid?
(I know... it should be a thread by itself)

:D:D:D
 
Why isn't the professional DM being paid?
Simple; because he's willing to work for free (or for the chance at tips.) If I was willing to accept no salary I'm sure my company would oblige me. If somebody equally qualified was willing to do my job for less, I'm sure my company would oblige him.
 
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