Tipping....how much do you tip?

[jim T.]

Unions: "The folks who brought you the Weekend" and the 8 hr. work day and anti-child labor laws. Just a thought.

 

[divingtigger]

I don't think competition is the sole reason for tipping. There are several industries that are very competitive (new auto sales, as example) where there is no tipping. Even among the same manufacturer, there is great competition for my business.

I think you missed his point all together. What he is saying is that the reason that the captain doesn't have as much money to pay the DM's is because people shop around and go for the lowest price, so they have to stay competitive.

Since you brought out new auto sales let me inform you on what goes on in Auto sales (my brother in law is a sales manager for a GM dealership).

If you sell a car at or above sticker, the dealership makes alot of money and passes a percentage down to the salesman who makes the sale, however if you are selling a car for too much you won't make as many sales and since the dealership has to clear it's overhead the salesmen don't see much if any. Now if the dealership is selling cars for the same price or less than others there is money to pass down to the salesmen, just not as much as ones who are selling for huge mark up. Prime example is the 0% financing they had. The car manufacturers were almost loosing money (up here atleast) because one manufactuer said that it could do 0% and the others has to follow suit or lose sales. Who do you think it really hurt? The salesman

 

[caymaniac]

Unions: "The folks who brought you the Weekend" and the 8 hr. work day and anti-child labor laws. Just a thought.

I guess I don't know ANYONE that works just 8 hrs. per day. Do you mean teachers..nope, electicians...nope, builders....nope, county workers...nope, insurance agents...no, lawyers....no, who works just 8 hrs. per day? Who can afford to?
My friends are professional and none of them work 8 hour days, my friends also include construction workers, and county workers, none of them work 8 hrs. a day and most all of them work some weekends.
Unions have been a good thing in the beginning of the last century (child labor) but now manufacturing is going away, thanks to the guy who signed NAFTA (Bill Clinton). Without manufacturing what will the U.S. become? That is the question.

 

[Waterskier1]

I think you missed his point all together. What he is saying is that the reason that the captain doesn't have as much money to pay the DM's is because people shop around and go for the lowest price, so they have to stay competitive.

Since you brought out new auto sales let me inform you on what goes on in Auto sales (my brother in law is a sales manager for a GM dealership).

If you sell a car at or above sticker, the dealership makes alot of money and passes a percentage down to the salesman who makes the sale, however if you are selling a car for too much you won't make as many sales and since the dealership has to clear it's overhead the salesmen don't see much if any. Now if the dealership is selling cars for the same price or less than others there is money to pass down to the salesmen, just not as much as ones who are selling for huge mark up. Prime example is the 0% financing they had.

Even though this is off point of HOW MUCH to tip, I don't see that starting to tip new car salesmen is the answer to fair competition. I suspect, right or wrong, as long as someone is there, wanting and willing to sell that car at whatever little income, there will be no raises for salesmen. The same holds true for DMs.

 

[jbmooney]

...who works just 8 hrs. per day? Who can afford to?

I think you just made Jim's point, and mine was that the unfettered "free market" that drives that race to the bottom had nothing to do with the foundation of our country.

Completely apart from that issue, free markets depend on perfect information to even do what they do well, and that sort of information is a hypothetical commodity only. This thread is a case in point.

Tipping works fine in the foodservice industry (in no small part because it creates the distortion of allowing relatively low-pay workers to hide a lot of their income), and it will probably work OK in the dive business too, as soon as everyone understands that a tip is expected for good service. As Waterski and HDIGIT (and several others) have noted, the question is what's expected or customary. That custom sounds highly variable, according to this thread, and not well publicized at all, according to both my experience and others', apparently.

Fix that problem, and many DMs will come home with more money in their pockets, not because the "free market" has decreed it, but because divers with disposable luxury income will recognize that paying the marginal additional costs of supporting the pros who help make our vacations a better experience is the right thing to do. There will still be "free riders", but they will be fewer, because most of us don't want to be jerks.

 

[caymaniac]

...who works just 8 hrs. per day? Who can afford to?

I think you just made Jim's point, and mine was that the unfettered "free market" that drives that race to the bottom had nothing to do with the foundation of our country.


Tipping works fine in the foodservice industry (in no small part because it creates the distortion of allowing relatively low-pay workers to hide a lot of their income), and it will probably work OK in the dive business too, as soon as everyone understands that a tip is expected for good service. As Waterski and HDIGIT (and several others) have noted, the question is what's expected or customary. That custom sounds highly variable, according to this thread, and not well publicized at all, according to both my experience and others', apparently.
:

Before the beginning of our country, it was fettered by taxes as one can read about the Boston Tea party. I think free market has alot to do with western civilization and this country has been one of the best examples of free market but, it is becoming less of a free market. Look at the scolialistic view of more taxes, medicine, more taxes, unions, more taxes, .....did I mention more tax?
Back to the tip idea.....the culture has been created and no matter what anyone will do, it will have no effect on changing the tipping culture. I agree with you a tip is expected for good service, the question remains what you feel " good service" means happens to be different for an individual. I've seen "bad service" earn a tip and this is what leads to no tipping in my view. So you have a group of young people working for low or no pay serving older people with money and sometimes that creates an attitude!

 

[jjflash]

Back to topic - $5 per tank is good rule of thumb (that works out at about 12% of what we charge for a 2 tank trip here) but theres no real right or wrong. If you've done a few days diving with the same crew then say 15-20% would be appropriate if they have done a nice job. Thats what I would tip at which is pretty much what I tip anyone really!

Cheers
Paul

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

Boy oh boy, reading most of these posts just reminds me why I am a resort instructor in Wailea! I work on commission, we do not sell or even rent gear and our specialty is shore diving so there is no boat to scrub. The guests are generous when we pamper them and even more generous when we give them or their loved ones an unforgettable experience. Finally, if we treat them better than average they send us all their very generous friends and family. Luckily none of them troll SB to find out if they should tip for services rendered.

 

[peterbj7]

I envy you! I'm a resort instructor/owner, I do sell and rent gear, and I have 5 boats to maintain. Oh for the simple life!!

 

[jbmooney]

Luckily none of them troll SB to find out if they should tip for services rendered.

From the posts of some of your colleagues elsewhere, you are indeed lucky in your clients. As for myself, I'm happy to have seen the thread and understand that tipping is a part of the transaction. Without "trolling SB". I wouldn't have known that, and might not have left a tip (as I wouldn't at a pub in Limerick).