Thoughts in Dive Cancellations

[MrChen]

John, where in Florida?

I haven't ran into this yet with the dive ops I've been on in the Jupiter/WPB area. Not to say it can't happen, but I'd be SHOCKED if a couple of them refused to go out due to cancellations. What's BS is, if the cancelled divers lost their deposits, then the boat op got paid anyways and should take the remaining divers out, even if it doesn't meet a minimum. What I mean is, say the min is 6 and 2 people cancel, but lost their deposit, then the boat should still go out since they collected from the 2 no shows.

I always pay by credit card, but they don't charge it until the day of the trip or will charge me full price if I don't cancel with at least 24 hours notice. I'm fine with that and have only missed one boat dive due to getting sick at the last minute. But I would expect that the boat would still go since my seat is paid for. That's a pretty scumbag move not to go out, but to collect from the cancelled divers. If I heard that the boat didn't go out, I'd dispute the charge.

 

[kwinter]

Around here the general policy is you book the dive, you pay for the dive. If you cancel, you have to find someone to take your spot. If the boat isn't full, it puts you in direct competition with whoever has the charter trying to fill the empty spots. If you find someone, then you are not charged or the person pays you back. If the boat fills up, then you can turn your spot back over to the chartering shop or the boat. If they can fill it, you get your money back. Otherwise, it's on you.

This has a great deal of fairness built into it. I admit that it might be preferable to only pay a small penalty as long as your cancellation is enough in advance to give the charter the opportunity to cancel. After all, if you hadn't signed up they might have gone out anyway with the number they have. But your spot was held for you and might have kept a larger group from being able to sign up. I only had a problem one time when the shop kept my money even after I filled my spot with a replacement. They eventually saw the error in their ways.

I have NEVER heard of a charter cancelling a trip and keeping deposit money except in cases of outright thievery. If a boat cancelled on me and kept my money, that boat would be sitting on the bottom in the marina very quickly.

 

[sportxlh]

Interesting. I'm a local diver and have never booked with more than one dive operator just to 'play the odds'. I have a handful of dive boats/shops that I tend to use and I know their policies. If I am concerned that a dive might get cancelled because I'm suspicious that divers will review the marine conditions report and bail out and cancel their reservations at the last moment (hence scrubbing the trip), I usually ask the dive operator how many people have already reserved before I make my reservation. If only a couple of divers have reserved, I won't make a reservation with that particular operator and will go with my second choice for the day. Then again, I tend to make my reservations at the last minute, usually only a day or two before I plan to dive (one of the benefits to having so many shops nearby).

With that said, I've had several Florida operators make trips with less than the minimum number of divers just to keep a regular customer(s) happy.

I do think that it is somewhat unethical to make multiple reservations.

As a side note, I've found that shops that conduct training (like Jupiter Dive Center or Scuba Club or South Florida Dive HQ or Conch Republic) or are a common dive boat choice for non-affiliated instructors are least likely to cancel since they always seem to have a couple of students and an instructor doing training dives.

Lastly, if a dive operator took my credit card info, but then the dive shop cancelled the trip, I'd dispute that charge with my credit card company. The only exception would be for live-aboards which clearly tell you to buy trip insurance.

 

[Steve_C]

I had a trip in Key West cancelled due to insufficient divers. What the op, and apparently a few others, did was call around to figure out who had a boat going out. We got our dives in and they actually turned out cheaper. So why not partner up with one or two other ops for these situations and take turns being "the boat" that goes out. If 3 different boats are canceling because they only have 1-2 divers, that's now 3-6 divers out a couple of dives.

Happens all the time with the boats going out of the Holiday Inn marina on Key Largo. Another reason I dive there. Been put on another boat several times.

 

[MrChen]

Interesting. I'm a local diver and have never booked with more than one dive operator just to 'play the odds'. I have a handful of dive boats/shops that I tend to use and I know their policies. If I am concerned that a dive might get cancelled because I'm suspicious that divers will review the marine conditions report and bail out and cancel their reservations at the last moment (hence scrubbing the trip), I usually ask the dive operator how many people have already reserved before I make my reservation. If only a couple of divers have reserved, I won't make a reservation with that particular operator and will go with my second choice for the day. Then again, I tend to make my reservations at the last minute, usually only a day or two before I plan to dive (one of the benefits to having so many shops nearby).

With that said, I've had several Florida operators make trips with less than the minimum number of divers just to keep a regular customer(s) happy.

I do think that it is somewhat unethical to make multiple reservations.

As a side note, I've found that shops that conduct training (like Jupiter Dive Center or Scuba Club or South Florida Dive HQ or Conch Republic) or are a common dive boat choice for non-affiliated instructors are least likely to cancel since they always seem to have a couple of students and an instructor doing training dives.

Lastly, if a dive operator took my credit card info, but then the dive shop cancelled the trip, I'd dispute that charge with my credit card company. The only exception would be for live-aboards which clearly tell you to buy trip insurance.

I think we live in a great area for diving. I only get to book 1-2 a month and the dang boats are always full. I agree that it would be unethical and unfair to the dive ops and divers. I've never booked more than one and the one time I booked on JDC, they didn't ask for a deposit. The one time I dove Abernathy, I booked through Scuba Works. We had 5 or 6 divers and the Abernathy shop filled the boat up with employees (was a night dive to Mizpah/Amaryllis).

 

[CajunDiva]

From the viewpoint of an experienced diver:

I think if this happened to me I would be severely peeved. We don't have access to local diving, so every time we want to dive it involves a long trip to somewhere. For us, that somewhere in the USA is Key Largo. We have to pay for transportation to and from Key Largo, someplace to stay, our food during the trip, and our diving. If I would go through all that time and effort and expense, looking forward to having a week of great diving, only to have diving trips cancelled...I would be pissed.

On the bright side, that has NEVER happened to us. I suppose when you find the right dive op for you, and you become a LOYAL customer and build a relationship with the staff, you develop a level of trust that you will be taken care of. We dive with Rainbow Reef Dive Center in Key Largo, and have been for over 10 years. I know the primary staff, and I have known and loved many of the DM's and Instructors working on the boats. Developing friendships is a good thing. I know the last thing they want to do is make me miserable!

I have witnessed numerous times where people who have reservations to dive either cancel or don't show up at the Rainbow Reef kiosk. Incidentally, they don't get charged a fee at all, because there are always people waiting there to take their place, so there have always been plenty of divers to warrant taking the boat out. The only time we've experienced a problem is when the weather/winds were too bad and the situation was dangerous for diving. When that has happened, we have always received a phone call to let us know the boat would not be going out. Boy...this was a ROUGH year for wind!!! Let's hope 2014 is MUCH better.

I confess to being somewhat naive about things like this. I am not the type who would EVER book with more than one dive OP and take the best option. I fully believe that it's best to be honest and be a good repeat customer, then your relationship will carry you through and you will get the best treatment possible. At least that's how I roll

 

[scubadada]

Now down in the Florida Keys the previous posts is why I like to dive with Ocean Divers. They have a 2 diver min even on their big boats. Horizon has a 4 diver min.

+1 for Ocean Divers in Key Largo. I've been out with them several times with just 2 divers, especially on the Sunday afternoon wreck dive. In addition, their big Newtons are good when the seas are up and they go out whenever it is safe

 

[KeithG]

I agree with Hawkwood that this appears to be a regional issue.

I have never had a dive cancelled by an operator for any reason other than very severe weather (hurricane). We also reserve and pay in advance since we are vacation divers and are jamming in a full week of dives. More than once we have been the only divers on a boat and even spent a week on a live aboard with more crew than passengers as only 6 divers were booked.

At vacation destinations the boat operator generally knows well in advance how many divers will be there. At there is very little daily variation over the course of a week.

It all depends on your destination.