The Great local dive shop vs. online debate

[BIGSAGE136]

I RECENTLY POSTED A THREAD VERY SIMILAR TO YOURS. I TOOK
SOME OF THE ADVICE AND GOT MY ONLINE PRICES TOGETHER AND SHARED THEM WITH MY LDS. THEY ACTUALLY BEAT LP ON MOST THE EQUIPMENT THAT I WANTED..ZEAGLE FLATHEAD WITH ZX OCTO & 3 GUAGE ANALOG CONSOLE. OTHER STUFF THEY CAME AS CLOSE TO AS POSSIBLE. THEY POINTED OUT THAT THEY WOULD ASSENMBLE IT, CHECK IT AND I WOULD HAVE THE ADVANTAGE OF THE WARRANTIES. THEY DIDNT PUSH ME. JUST LEFT ME WITH FOOD FOR THOUGHT. IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU HAVE THE BEST OF INTENTIONS FOR THE LDS BUT I HEAR YOU WHEN THE $$$FLUTTERS IN THE WIND. ITS YOUR DECISION, BUT IT DOES FEEL GOOD TO SHAKE A HAND AT THE COMPLETION OF THE SALE AND HAVE SOMEONE TO GO BACK TO IF SOMETHING FAILS.

GOOD LUCK AND SAFE DIVING.

 

[dep1466]

Even though someone like me who is new to the sport, purchases equipment online at a significant savings, the LDS will still eventually get money out of.
The equipment will still need to be serviced. I would then still have to take the equip to an LDS for service. My tanks still need to be filled. Plus any trips organized through by the LDS I am more than happy to pay for.
I bought my equip online through a Dacor factory authorized dealer, so I still have manufacturers warranty, and I paid a third of what I would have paid.
Bottom line is Im not willing to just give my money away.
If LDS could lower there prices, think of all the new customers they would get. Sales would increase dramaticly, and people would not have to look to the internet.

 

[medical1]

dep1466
"Quote
Even though someone like me who is new to the sport, purchases equipment online at a significant savings, the LDS will still eventually get money out of.
The equipment will still need to be serviced. I would then still have to take the equip to an LDS for service. My tanks still need to be filled. Plus any trips organized through by the LDS I am more than happy to pay for."
____________________________________________________
Nicely stated. A newbie sheep that was not lead to slaughter

The LDS better wake up. Our kids know about the internet too and are smart shoppers. Either give us value for our money or an incentive not to shop elsewhere.

Car companies have loyalty programs as well as airlines. Walk into a LDS and they gush over the new diver while trying to sell them the $150 pair of fins or additional classes while making the loyal customers wait. I have time to hang out so it's not a big deal but the message is pretty clear!

The next generation of divers have already begun to figure it out ut:

 

[MikeFerrara]

dep1466 once bubbled...
If LDS could lower there prices, think of all the new customers they would get. Sales would increase dramaticly, and people would not have to look to the internet.

That's just it. Read what I wrote. I'm telling you from experience that given the local market that the manufacturers force us into the sale don't increase enough to make up for the lost margin. Just using the Zeagle example above that price reduction would mean I would need to sell 7 times as many bc's to make the same money. Well actually more than 7 times as many since it would cost more time, shipping, testing (yes we test every one) ect to sell 7 times as many. In the area we oporated, in and remember they also limit our market by disallowing inline and mailorder, I wouldn't sell 7 time as many bc's if I sold them for $1 each because there just aren't that many people buying bc's.

Sales are not preportional to the percentage of markup. Somewhere there is a price that maximizes profit which isn't the same as the price that maximizes sales. However, given the limits of a walk in, local market the diference is small. What does make a huge difference in sales is selling tons of OW classes, teaching them the minimum and selling them a pretty colored package or two before they learn the game. This is what the most successful shops that I know do and they're not going to reduce margins accross the board to pick up a few extra sales. Their business is the newbies (some divers stay newbies don't forget) and there is money there if they're worked right.

 

[MikeFerrara]

medical1 once bubbled...
dep1466
"Quote
Even though someone like me who is new to the sport, purchases equipment online at a significant savings, the LDS will still eventually get money out of.
The equipment will still need to be serviced. I would then still have to take the equip to an LDS for service. My tanks still need to be filled. Plus any trips organized through by the LDS I am more than happy to pay for."
____________________________________________________
Nicely stated. A newbie sheep that was not lead to slaughter

The LDS better wake up. Our kids know about the internet too and are smart shoppers. Either give us value for our money or an incentive not to shop elsewhere.

Car companies have loyalty programs as well as airlines. Walk into a LDS and they gush over the new diver while trying to sell them the $150 pair of fins or additional classes while making the loyal customers wait. I have time to hang out so it's not a big deal but the message is pretty clear!

The next generation of divers have already begun to figure it out ut:

True more people are catching on to the net all the time and things will change. This year a number of manufacturers changed their mind and decided to allow us to sell online. Good move but they restricted the price just as before. Now what good would it do for me to put up an online store selling stuff at MSRP?

If you think that LDS prices are high, consider this, LP (and places like them) prices are artificially low. Fact they're not dealers and aren't bound by the same rules the shops are. If the shops are ever allowed to play on an even field their prices may be lower but all the prices will be higher than LP is now. It'll even out. Right now a small number of online merchants who somehowe can get product without being dealers have a small (but growing market) with little competition. It's a cakewalk but it won't last. Lets face it. The situation that allows the online folks to sell an Apeks reg for $200 and forces the LDS to ask $600 won't last and the end price isn't goint to be $200. Enjoy it while you can.

 

[Genesis]

What does make a huge difference in sales is selling tons of OW classes, teaching them the minimum and selling them a pretty colored package or two before they learn the game. This is what the most successful shops that I know do and they're not going to reduce margins accross the board to pick up a few extra sales

.... the approach to such a problem is to destroy those shop's market.

How?

Educate the "average joe" so that before he takes that OW class he knows that he can buy his mask at Walmart (they actually sell damn good masks around here!), snorkel (ditto) and fins (Leisurepro) either from discounters or mail order, and that the rest of their gear can come from LP too.

Now the guy who takes the OW class isn't a "mark" any more.

It will not take much of a shift in percentages of people who they cannot sell to before this type of "screw the consumer" marketing collapses.

 

[sasdasdaf]

sasdasdaf once bubbled...


absolutely, that's exactly that i believe. it boggles my mind that dive shops expect that you should buy anything from them. as consumers, we don't owe them anything - most times it comes down to $$$. if i can get the same exact item cheaper elsewhere, you can bet that i'll be buying it there. i encourage everyone to vote with the wallets and only patronize dive shops who 'have a clue' and can add value somehow.

let me give an example. recently i took a class with GUE instructor Bob Sherwood. He owns a dive shop. I have learned enough from him and taken enough of his good advice that if possible, I would buy from him. For example, he is a DUI dealer and knows how to take the correct measurements (don't laugh, you'll be surprised how many people screw it up). The next time I'm in the market for a drysuit, I'll buy it from Bob.

 

[medical1]

Correct me if I'm wrong (Wouldn't be the first time) but MSRP stands for Manufacturer SUGGESTED Retail Price. Not the lowest price an item can be sold. Even retail stores don't charge MSRP. :wacko:

Come on now - have you bought a car at MSRP? If not - did you feel bad for the salesman or the local dealership because you bought a car for less then the MSRP?

Consumer quote
"Give me a break - John Stocel"

 

[MJillKDives]

The problem with Leisure Pro is that, to my knowledge, they are not an authorized dealer of any line of equipment. And most manufacutrers will not honor warranties on equipment that was not purchased from an authorized dealer. This also means that you don't know where their inventory is coming from; counterfeit Scubapro bc's have turned up at Leisure Pro.

A friend of mine bought a hoseless Oceanic computer at LP only to have the unit promptly malfunction. I don't have the answer, but it could be that the computer was part of a flawed lot that was never meant for retail sale but nevertheless found its way to LP. Fortunatley for him, Oceanic agreed to rebiuild the computer for about $160.

I admit to purchasing small items such as lights from LP, but for major purchases I think it's better to buy from an authorized dealer.

 

[scubajim]

It's a good idea to buy your life support gear from a LDS. If you ever have any problems they will take care of you. Sometimes they have sales on stuff. I bought my last tank from my LDS and he threw in a boot, sleeve and 4 free fills. The deal turned out better than online.
Buy your non life support online.

Good luck