the "Eco Kick" ...

[MXGratefulDiver]

Yeah, but in all the side talk I lost track of the article and what it was about. People talking about making classes just for this stuff. It confused my simple mind. Lol

Last year I started offering a workshop ... four dives working on skills, customized to the needs of the diver. It's primarily for folks who are OW certified, but not real experienced yet. I taught the class 14 times last year, and so far twice this year. By far the most requested skill in that workshop is a frog kick.

I agree with you that it's something that can be taught in an OW class ... particularly one that's being taught in a longer format, such as a college class. But the fact is that the majority of OW classes don't ... and won't ... teach it. So where do people learn it?

I don't think a class is such a bad idea ... but if that's the case it should be bundled with other skills ... a "trim, propulsion and buoyancy control" workshop is a pretty good format. And based on my experiences there's clearly a market out there for it. The biggest obstacle seems to be getting sanction from the agency you teach for ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[diverrex]

Last year I started offering a workshop ... four dives working on skills, customized to the needs of the diver. It's primarily for folks who are OW certified, but not real experienced yet. I taught the class 14 times last year, and so far twice this year. By far the most requested skill in that workshop is a frog kick.

I agree with you that it's something that can be taught in an OW class ... particularly one that's being taught in a longer format, such as a college class. But the fact is that the majority of OW classes don't ... and won't ... teach it. So where do people learn it?

I don't think a class is such a bad idea ... but if that's the case it should be bundled with other skills ... a "trim, propulsion and buoyancy control" workshop is a pretty good format. And based on my experiences there's clearly a market out there for it. The biggest obstacle seems to be getting sanction from the agency you teach for ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Why do you need sanction from the agency? Can't you just teach a workshop of any kind you want but not give out a cert? Or does the agency have liability issues since you are an instructor under them and they want to have say in anything taught?

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Why do you need sanction from the agency? Can't you just teach a workshop of any kind you want but not give out a cert? Or does the agency have liability issues since you are an instructor under them and they want to have say in anything taught?

... it depends on the agency ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Peter Guy]

Why do you need sanction from the agency?

I got caught up in this issue last year when, pretty much on a lark, I offered to teach a "fundies light" class at my PADI 5 Star Shop -- a non-cert "workshop." An instructor from another shop complained to PADI that it was an "illegal" course being offered in violation of the "5 Star" agreement. The conversations with PADI HQ were interesting in that the person who had been instructed to handle the matter wanted me to teach the class but was constrained by the contract. He really pleaded with me to submit the class to PADI to get okayed as a "PADI Distinctive Specialty." I refused (at first).

Then I finally called my instructor liability insurance broker and found out that while I might be covered if I taught it as a workshop, I would be much better off to have it be a recognized class (a Distinctive Specialty). As it turned out, it was much easier to make the application to PADI than I had thought (no doubt because I had long ago written the whole course outline so it was really just a matter of filling in blanks from what I had already prepared). PADI then approved the course and so I am now certified to teach the "TecReational Diver Distinctive Specialty" as a PADI class.

www.belowandbeyond.biz/tecreational_diver.htm

We have a very good group of instructors here in the Seattle area (PADI, NAUI, GUE, UTD) that are all teaching very similarly and there is just no excuse for people to not get good instruction except for the lack of knowledge that such exists.

 

[ScubaInChicago]

I got caught up in this issue last year when, pretty much on a lark, I offered to teach a "fundies light" class at my PADI 5 Star Shop -- a non-cert "workshop." An instructor from another shop complained to PADI that it was an "illegal" course being offered in violation of the "5 Star" agreement. The conversations with PADI HQ were interesting in that the person who had been instructed to handle the matter wanted me to teach the class but was constrained by the contract. He really pleaded with me to submit the class to PADI to get okayed as a "PADI Distinctive Specialty." I refused (at first).

Then I finally called my instructor liability insurance broker and found out that while I might be covered if I taught it as a workshop, I would be much better off to have it be a recognized class (a Distinctive Specialty). As it turned out, it was much easier to make the application to PADI than I had thought (no doubt because I had long ago written the whole course outline so it was really just a matter of filling in blanks from what I had already prepared). PADI then approved the course and so I am now certified to teach the "TecReational Diver Distinctive Specialty" as a PADI class.

www.belowandbeyond.biz/tecreational_diver.htm

We have a very good group of instructors here in the Seattle area (PADI, NAUI, GUE, UTD) that are all teaching very similarly and there is just no excuse for people to not get good instruction except for the lack of knowledge that such exists.

I'm disturbed that PADI Distinctive Specialties are so easy to be approved. Do you have any idea how much time and effort went into the whale watching specialty?

 

[Dhboner]

I thought "Eco Kick" meant using fins made of recycled rubber!

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I got a crazy idea. How about teaching all this in OW class!?!? Radical I know, but it can be done.

Some of us already are. In fact I'm teaching it to kids from age 7 up in my snorkeling/skin diving classes. I have one little girl about four feet nothing and maybe 60 lbs that uses a frog on the surface and modified frog underwater almost exclusively. She says it's not as hard to do as the scissor or flutter and doesn't hurt her knees. Time to teach it to her? About ten minutes. Making it a specialty would just demonstrate unmitigated greed.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

 

[JamesK]

I'm not saying a workshop is a bad idea. I think workshops are phenomenal. Mentoring for those who don't have good mentors or were not taught properly. I vastly prefer mentoring and workshops or 90% of the specialities out there. I am saying that a speciality card for these basic skills is a horrible idea! Pure crap. The agencies need to incorporate this at the basic level.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I'm not saying a workshop is a bad idea. I think workshops are phenomenal. Mentoring for those who don't have good mentors or were not taught properly. I vastly prefer mentoring and workshops or 90% of the specialities out there. I am saying that a speciality card for these basic skills is a horrible idea! Pure crap. The agencies need to incorporate this at the basic level.

... first they'd have to teach it to the instructors ... I know many who not only don't know how to do a frog kick, but don't believe it has any real purpose in scuba diving ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[JamesK]

... first they'd have to teach it to the instructors ... I know many who not only don't know how to do a frog kick, but don't believe it has any real purpose in scuba diving ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Lol. Good point.