KOMPRESSOR
Contributor
Eh... No? But kind of a "cute" solution! What kind of calming music would you like to be played as the seals are "put to sleep"??!
Seriously... What were you thinking of when you wrote this?
The Canadian Seal Slaughter
- Thread starter Aquatic Eagle
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Eh... No? But kind of a "cute" solution! What kind of calming music would you like to be played as the seals are "put to sleep"??!
Seriously... What were you thinking of when you wrote this?
fisherdvm
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It does not make sense as:
1. It is a controlled substance, and only can be administered under the supervision of a veterinarian.
2. It is more stressful for the animal, as restraint is required, prolonging their suffering.
3. It is hard to train individuals intravenous injection method, and would require at least 2 if not more trained individuals to administer.
Certainly, one can consider subcutanous route, but it is slow, and much less effective.
are you a veterinarian fisher?? As for Kompressor I was thinking Moby or maybe some chill or light drum and bass techno. I know here in MD when there is an overpopulation event of any animal they first use relocation techniques to cull the numbers. This involves trapping and moving animals. They then implement tactics similar to what I described. According to my research independent veterinarians whom studied the seal hunt found it to be far more cruel then practically any other animal industry. These findings were published and I have found a website detailing a synopsis of what was found:
Here’s what one such international team of five independent veterinarians found:
This is quoted from a Wikipedia article on the seal hunt:
A study of the 2001 Canadian seal hunt conducted by five independent veterinarians, commissioned by the International Fund for Animal Welfare (IFAW), [49] concluded that, although the hakapik is a humane means of hunting, many hunters were not using it properly. This improper use, they said, was leading to "considerable and unacceptable suffering," and in 17 percent of the cases they observed, there were no detectable lesions of the skull whatsoever. In numerous other cases, the seals had to be struck multiple times before they were considered "unconscious."[50] These findings are at odds with the CVMA report which states that Daoust, at the same time and in the same location, recorded that 86 percent of skulls had been completely crushed by strikes with hakapiks. It states further that two years previously, Bollinger and Campbell had recorded that 98.2 percent of the skulls examined were completely crushed.[51]
In 2005, the World Wildlife Fund (WWF) commissioned the Independent Veterinarians Working Group Report. With reference to video evidence, the report states: "Perception of the seal hunt seems to be based largely on emotion, and on visual images that are often difficult even for experienced observers to interpret with certainty. While a hakapik strike on the skull of a seal appears brutal, it is humane if it achieves rapid, irreversible loss of consciousness leading to death."[52]
The 2001 report contained a number of recommendations on how sealing could be conducted more humanely. They did not, however, recommend the disuse of the controversial hakapik. Actually, the report recommended more training, mandatory blink-reflex tests for unconsciousness, and the cessation of open-water hunting. The report also recommended that seals be bled out immediately after clubbing, in order to ensure that the animals are unconscious when skinning begins. This is a recommendation taken in response to incidents of seals regaining consciousness after clubbing.[53] It has also been strongly recommended that seals killed by guns to be shot to a quick death, not be wounded and left to die. The 2002 CVMA report, however, indicated an average time of 45.2 seconds between the animal being shot and a sealer killing it with a hakapik. The report concluded that this time compared well with established and acceptable humane killing practices according to the Agreement on International Humane Trapping Standards where acceptable times range from 45-300 seconds.
Here is a large article detail the adverse effects and level of suffering brought on by the seal hunt. It's far too large to quote directly:
The Canadian Seal Hunt Resumes - Advocacy For Animals
A cruel hunt
Here’s what one such international team of five independent veterinarians found:
- 79% of the sealers did not check to see if an animal was dead before skinning it.
- In 40% of the kills a sealer had to strike the seal a second time, presumably because it was still conscious after the first blow or shot.
- 42% of killed seals examined were found to have minimal or no fractures, suggesting a high probability that these seals were conscious when skinned.
This is quoted from a Wikipedia article on the seal hunt:
A study of the 2001 Canadian seal hunt conducted by five independent veterinarians, commissioned by the International Fund for Animal Welfare (IFAW), [49] concluded that, although the hakapik is a humane means of hunting, many hunters were not using it properly. This improper use, they said, was leading to "considerable and unacceptable suffering," and in 17 percent of the cases they observed, there were no detectable lesions of the skull whatsoever. In numerous other cases, the seals had to be struck multiple times before they were considered "unconscious."[50] These findings are at odds with the CVMA report which states that Daoust, at the same time and in the same location, recorded that 86 percent of skulls had been completely crushed by strikes with hakapiks. It states further that two years previously, Bollinger and Campbell had recorded that 98.2 percent of the skulls examined were completely crushed.[51]
In 2005, the World Wildlife Fund (WWF) commissioned the Independent Veterinarians Working Group Report. With reference to video evidence, the report states: "Perception of the seal hunt seems to be based largely on emotion, and on visual images that are often difficult even for experienced observers to interpret with certainty. While a hakapik strike on the skull of a seal appears brutal, it is humane if it achieves rapid, irreversible loss of consciousness leading to death."[52]
The 2001 report contained a number of recommendations on how sealing could be conducted more humanely. They did not, however, recommend the disuse of the controversial hakapik. Actually, the report recommended more training, mandatory blink-reflex tests for unconsciousness, and the cessation of open-water hunting. The report also recommended that seals be bled out immediately after clubbing, in order to ensure that the animals are unconscious when skinning begins. This is a recommendation taken in response to incidents of seals regaining consciousness after clubbing.[53] It has also been strongly recommended that seals killed by guns to be shot to a quick death, not be wounded and left to die. The 2002 CVMA report, however, indicated an average time of 45.2 seconds between the animal being shot and a sealer killing it with a hakapik. The report concluded that this time compared well with established and acceptable humane killing practices according to the Agreement on International Humane Trapping Standards where acceptable times range from 45-300 seconds.
Here is a large article detail the adverse effects and level of suffering brought on by the seal hunt. It's far too large to quote directly:
The Canadian Seal Hunt Resumes - Advocacy For Animals
A cruel hunt
I doubt the seals would cooperate while the hunters looked for a vein to put the IV in.
Papa_Bear
Contributor
Wouldn't the meat be contaminated as well? The trauma of catching the wild animal and subduing it in order to inject it would be traumatic! A quick head blow and its all over!
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I'm going to wade in here.., simply because my rear-end is getting sore from sitting on the fence. I've been reading this thread and wondering if anyone actually thinks they are going to change the mind of the others?
I am making an assumption here and thinking that a large majority of those here have never been to the ice...., thus your information, like it or not is filtered. By one side or the other. For example.., aquaman to keep quoting "independent veterinarians" in those studies, you should include the fact that they were hired by, paid for and funded by the IFAW. Like it or not.., they are hardly independent. Sort of like find a psychiatrist to testify someones crazy. It all depends on who's side they are on.
Opinion without background is useless so here's my deal.....
I am not a fan of the seal hunt.., but not an activist against it. Currently it is legal in Canada.., and with a cull of less than 300,000 seals out it a herd of 7 -10 million is pretty insignificant. I do not hunt and do not fish because killing things does not appeal to me personally, however have no objection to picking up a steak, chicken of fish from the Supermarket. I don't find hunters objectionable.., for some it is a passion like diving is to us. I'm just not a fan of waste and NEEDLESS suffering.
Unlike many of you (I'm guessing) I've been there. On the ice..., during the hunt. I had the opportunity to go so I went. Not with the hunters, not with the observers.., just to be there and take it all in. It was really something.
Don't get too fired up watching clips..., I could tevo a Sunday of football and put together a video showing football as nothing more than men in funny pants hugging each other and talk about how soft it is. Seal clips from the flows are like that. Five plus days of footage edited to several minutes. It could portray whatever they wanted it to.
Is the Seal Hunt brutal? I think so.., there is no pretty way to kill a wild animal. Seals have teeth and claws and scratch and bite.., needles are out of the question.
Do they suffer? Yes.., the question is needlessly. I don't think so. The sealers want a quick kill.., and while they do not cry over the deaths, neither do they rejoice.
Is it a necessary industry? Here on the east coast.., I've never met a sealer that the hunt was his main income. Normally it is between fishing seasons and they supplement their income with the seal hunt. Sort of like you and I working overtime. No one is going to starve if they do not go.., they just won't be able to get as big a TV of a fancy an SUV as if they did go.
Is the Seal Hunt no different than chicken and beef farms? No, it is apples and oranges. You can own and pay for and feed and tend livestock..., you have a financial investment in your property. The seals are wild free creatures that belong to no one.
Will sealers starve without the hunt? No
Do animal rights groups exploit this hunt to generate funds for themselves? Of course they do..., are you kidding. What's not to love? Cute little seals with big eyes.., lots or red blood on the stark glaring white ice. This day and age it is the best coverage they get annually. If they are so against it, are they ashamed that they are getting money because of it?
Do they use the whole animal? The hunt in my area is for the pelts. Leaving the carcass is a waste that bothers me about the whole hunt. Having said that, I've eaten seal meat, just to try it and it is not great IMHO. As far as the pelts go..., someone back a few posts mentioned the white coats (I'm not going back to look for it) there has not been a white coat hunt since the '80's
Polar Bears?? The Polar Bear population in Northern Canada (in spite of US 'experts' comments) is alive and well, thriving almost and is currently self-sustaining. They are not nearing extinction. Not even endangered. (Seen them in the wild too.., now THAT's a thrill. Wonderful creature)
Seals depleted the Cod stocks The Province of Newfoundland was decimated by the depleted cod stocks in the the early 90's, from which they have yet to rebound. Parts of the Province looked like 3rd world countries instead of North America.., with no money to be made. People were literally hunting to live in some areas. The stocks shrank due to a lot of reasons from over-fishing (domestic and foreign) to shifts in the gulf stream to the boom in seal population. The main diet of the seals is Cod.., and my only reason for supporting the hunt is the hopes that the cull will lower the seal numbers enough to allow the cod to bounce back. Say what you like..., 7 million seals eat a lot of cod.
The Canadian Coast Guard killed three sealers This is downright insulting..., there was an accident while the Coast Guard was towing a disabled fishing vessel.
The CCG rammed the Farley Mowat Who knows. The skipper of the icebreaker and the skipper of the Farley Mowat. Everyone else is guessing. The FM, as a foreign registered vessel was ordered to stay away from entering the Canadian waters around the hunt and came anyway. They say the CCG rammed them, the CCG says the Mowat struck the side of them. No one here knows what really happened, that is for sure. If they did ram them, so what. They disobeyed and said they intended to attend the hunt anyway. This icebreaker is huge.., if it wanted to the Mowat could have been eastern Canada's newest reef.
I am making an assumption here and thinking that a large majority of those here have never been to the ice...., thus your information, like it or not is filtered. By one side or the other. For example.., aquaman to keep quoting "independent veterinarians" in those studies, you should include the fact that they were hired by, paid for and funded by the IFAW. Like it or not.., they are hardly independent. Sort of like find a psychiatrist to testify someones crazy. It all depends on who's side they are on.
Opinion without background is useless so here's my deal.....
I am not a fan of the seal hunt.., but not an activist against it. Currently it is legal in Canada.., and with a cull of less than 300,000 seals out it a herd of 7 -10 million is pretty insignificant. I do not hunt and do not fish because killing things does not appeal to me personally, however have no objection to picking up a steak, chicken of fish from the Supermarket. I don't find hunters objectionable.., for some it is a passion like diving is to us. I'm just not a fan of waste and NEEDLESS suffering.
Unlike many of you (I'm guessing) I've been there. On the ice..., during the hunt. I had the opportunity to go so I went. Not with the hunters, not with the observers.., just to be there and take it all in. It was really something.
Don't get too fired up watching clips..., I could tevo a Sunday of football and put together a video showing football as nothing more than men in funny pants hugging each other and talk about how soft it is. Seal clips from the flows are like that. Five plus days of footage edited to several minutes. It could portray whatever they wanted it to.
Is the Seal Hunt brutal? I think so.., there is no pretty way to kill a wild animal. Seals have teeth and claws and scratch and bite.., needles are out of the question.
Do they suffer? Yes.., the question is needlessly. I don't think so. The sealers want a quick kill.., and while they do not cry over the deaths, neither do they rejoice.
Is it a necessary industry? Here on the east coast.., I've never met a sealer that the hunt was his main income. Normally it is between fishing seasons and they supplement their income with the seal hunt. Sort of like you and I working overtime. No one is going to starve if they do not go.., they just won't be able to get as big a TV of a fancy an SUV as if they did go.
Is the Seal Hunt no different than chicken and beef farms? No, it is apples and oranges. You can own and pay for and feed and tend livestock..., you have a financial investment in your property. The seals are wild free creatures that belong to no one.
Will sealers starve without the hunt? No
Do animal rights groups exploit this hunt to generate funds for themselves? Of course they do..., are you kidding. What's not to love? Cute little seals with big eyes.., lots or red blood on the stark glaring white ice. This day and age it is the best coverage they get annually. If they are so against it, are they ashamed that they are getting money because of it?
Do they use the whole animal? The hunt in my area is for the pelts. Leaving the carcass is a waste that bothers me about the whole hunt. Having said that, I've eaten seal meat, just to try it and it is not great IMHO. As far as the pelts go..., someone back a few posts mentioned the white coats (I'm not going back to look for it) there has not been a white coat hunt since the '80's
Polar Bears?? The Polar Bear population in Northern Canada (in spite of US 'experts' comments) is alive and well, thriving almost and is currently self-sustaining. They are not nearing extinction. Not even endangered. (Seen them in the wild too.., now THAT's a thrill. Wonderful creature)
Seals depleted the Cod stocks The Province of Newfoundland was decimated by the depleted cod stocks in the the early 90's, from which they have yet to rebound. Parts of the Province looked like 3rd world countries instead of North America.., with no money to be made. People were literally hunting to live in some areas. The stocks shrank due to a lot of reasons from over-fishing (domestic and foreign) to shifts in the gulf stream to the boom in seal population. The main diet of the seals is Cod.., and my only reason for supporting the hunt is the hopes that the cull will lower the seal numbers enough to allow the cod to bounce back. Say what you like..., 7 million seals eat a lot of cod.
The Canadian Coast Guard killed three sealers This is downright insulting..., there was an accident while the Coast Guard was towing a disabled fishing vessel.
The CCG rammed the Farley Mowat Who knows. The skipper of the icebreaker and the skipper of the Farley Mowat. Everyone else is guessing. The FM, as a foreign registered vessel was ordered to stay away from entering the Canadian waters around the hunt and came anyway. They say the CCG rammed them, the CCG says the Mowat struck the side of them. No one here knows what really happened, that is for sure. If they did ram them, so what. They disobeyed and said they intended to attend the hunt anyway. This icebreaker is huge.., if it wanted to the Mowat could have been eastern Canada's newest reef.
Darnold9999
Contributor
Engage the rational side of your brain - your maternal/paternal instincts are being manipulated for your money.
We are talking about harvesting an animal for its fur. Those who object check out your closets - any leather shoes? Got a leather coat? An animal was killed in order for that leather to exist. Yes, the rest of the animal was used for some other purpose but it was most probably raised in brutal conditions, particularly its last couple of weeks of life. But not cute, and necessary for our comfort, so who cares. City people need to spend some time on a farm to discover that meat does not come from styrofoam containers and leather from hanger trees, but living breathing creatures and that killing them is in fact killing them and the killing is often a brutal process.
If you are Vegan, don't wear leather, don't eat meat, or fish then by all means argue against killing seals for fur and meat. I can respect that point of view and we can have a rational discussion. Don't agree, but understand it. However - lets protect some because they are cute and don't impact MY way of life is hypocritical IMHO.
If the seal was endangered or even threatened I am all for protecting it. But protecting it because of the way it is killed??? Not tortured, killed. Use a gun instead of a club??? How exactly is that less cruel?
It just looks awful to see cute little furry animals clubbed to death. A reasonably efficient way of killing in this particular case. Small slow moving animal with a fragile skull. Ever been hit in the head hard enough to knock you out? Do you even remember the event?
There species in the world that are truly in danger of extiction that need your attention that are not cute and cuddly.
We are talking about harvesting an animal for its fur. Those who object check out your closets - any leather shoes? Got a leather coat? An animal was killed in order for that leather to exist. Yes, the rest of the animal was used for some other purpose but it was most probably raised in brutal conditions, particularly its last couple of weeks of life. But not cute, and necessary for our comfort, so who cares. City people need to spend some time on a farm to discover that meat does not come from styrofoam containers and leather from hanger trees, but living breathing creatures and that killing them is in fact killing them and the killing is often a brutal process.
If you are Vegan, don't wear leather, don't eat meat, or fish then by all means argue against killing seals for fur and meat. I can respect that point of view and we can have a rational discussion. Don't agree, but understand it. However - lets protect some because they are cute and don't impact MY way of life is hypocritical IMHO.
If the seal was endangered or even threatened I am all for protecting it. But protecting it because of the way it is killed??? Not tortured, killed. Use a gun instead of a club??? How exactly is that less cruel?
It just looks awful to see cute little furry animals clubbed to death. A reasonably efficient way of killing in this particular case. Small slow moving animal with a fragile skull. Ever been hit in the head hard enough to knock you out? Do you even remember the event?
There species in the world that are truly in danger of extiction that need your attention that are not cute and cuddly.
Well Darnold I am not a "city person" that needs to see where meat comes from. In fact in the very rural area where I grew up my parents raised beef cows for slaughter when I was young. Granted we didn't have a huge head of cows but I certainly saw how they were raised and slaughtered. In addition to that when I was in high school for an agricultural course I took we toured several large scale beef farms. In both cases the animals had very good living conditions and were fed and their health monitored on a nearly obsessive basis. Now this may not be the norm for all beef farms across the Earth but it was the case for the one's I had experience with.
In addition to that my fiance has her degree in Enviromental Microbiology and has studied and worked first hand with research farms that take a very active role in the beef industry as well as other forms of agriculture. There are some very disgusting things that take place in agricultural scientific research though in most cases it's for the betterment of the species in general. I disagree with animal research about 80% of the time, but not all of the time.
My exposure to agriculture in this regard (and growing up in a place that basis large amounts of income on agriculture) has not turned me off from eating beef or poultry. I've seen poultry farms as well. Beef is a staple part of many diets in the U.S. and Europe and abroad. Beef cattle are bred and raised for the sole purpose to be slaughtered as a food source. A lot of attention has been applied by veterinarians as to how this is done both from a humane aspect and also from a sanitary aspect.
I do eat beef and chicken and pork. I do not however wear any animal products what so ever. In addition to that I suffer from a digestive disorder and if I eat a large number of various vegetables I get pretty sick. I'm also lactose intolerant so when choosing a diet regiment that is healthy I almost have to include beef, chicken and pork. I also consume seafood of various types but I only eat seafood that has been approved as sustainable and environmentally friendly by the Monterey Bay Aquarium.
I totally support the vegan life style and think it's a wonderful thing though I do not partake in it wholly. That said my problem with the seal hunt is the same problem that I have with shark fin soup and whale meat.
Beef, chicken and pork are all sustainable and totally renewable. The form a staple part of the diet for many, many people and many, many animals. These animals are bred and raised for the sole purpose of providing a food source. I don't think anyone could argue that a hamburger or chuck steak is a luxury item, it's a food source and an inexpensive one at that. Is a ham sandwich a luxury or a chicken sandwich perhaps?
Shark fin soup is depleting a natural resource and risking the ecological hiarchey of our oceans in the process. Shark fin soup is a luxury item that wealthy Asian people use as a status symbol. It does not provide a major food source or dietary need to the people that consume it. It is a very wasteful and horrible practice.
Whale meat again is a luxury item that is depleting a natural resource. I have read countless articles by marine biologists and marine scientists speaking that the slaughter of great whales is wreaking havoc on oceanic eco-systems.
While it appears that seals are abundant they are being killed again for luxury items. From the videos I have watched and articles I have read these animals are skinned on the ice and the corpse is left rotting. Again these pelts are fashioned into coats that are used as a status symbol and serve a luxury purpose. I believe, no matter what any person says, that the seal hunt and bashing in of an animals skull is not humane. I also feel that the practices of certain slaughter houses and other agricultural industries are not humane either and I am in stark opposition to those as well.
I see the seal hunt as a robbery from nature, robbing an animal of life to provide a human being with nothing more then a lavish luxury item. From what ditch-diver has posted it provides a dual luxury for both those who buy seal pelt clothing items and the seal hunters themselves. Again as I stated earlier I feel that people who can run across ice flats and mash in baby animal's heads, then skin them (while some are still alive) should be spending their extra seal hunt money on a therapist. I couldn't myself do it. Perhaps it's because I was raised in a home where I was taught to respect animals equally as much as man. Perhaps it's because growing up I always had dogs, horses, fish, and the natural wildlife of my home front to keep my company and I have countless personal relationships with animals.
As I asked earlier how can you watch the seal hunt and not think of your family dog being in the position of the baby seal. Who are we to say it's alright in the case of the seal but not in other cases. A life is a life - human or animal. Kind of like what Horton said, "a person is a person no matter how small." If we must take an animal life to provide a NEED (like in the case of agricultural and the slaughter of animals as a food source) then I feel we must seek the most humane and moral ways to do that.
This isn't the stone age anymore. I am someone who feels man needs to try living in better harmony with his surroundings and a lot less killing needs to take place. The oceans are over fished by 60%+ - coral reef decline is accelerating and soon 80% of coral reefs will be gone - shark stocks and numbers of all large fish are over 80% gone - there will have been a greater environmental decline between 1980 and 2045 then there has been in the past 65 million years. I think it's pretty clear that man needs to change some of his more undesirable actions for the future's sake.
In addition to that my fiance has her degree in Enviromental Microbiology and has studied and worked first hand with research farms that take a very active role in the beef industry as well as other forms of agriculture. There are some very disgusting things that take place in agricultural scientific research though in most cases it's for the betterment of the species in general. I disagree with animal research about 80% of the time, but not all of the time.
My exposure to agriculture in this regard (and growing up in a place that basis large amounts of income on agriculture) has not turned me off from eating beef or poultry. I've seen poultry farms as well. Beef is a staple part of many diets in the U.S. and Europe and abroad. Beef cattle are bred and raised for the sole purpose to be slaughtered as a food source. A lot of attention has been applied by veterinarians as to how this is done both from a humane aspect and also from a sanitary aspect.
I do eat beef and chicken and pork. I do not however wear any animal products what so ever. In addition to that I suffer from a digestive disorder and if I eat a large number of various vegetables I get pretty sick. I'm also lactose intolerant so when choosing a diet regiment that is healthy I almost have to include beef, chicken and pork. I also consume seafood of various types but I only eat seafood that has been approved as sustainable and environmentally friendly by the Monterey Bay Aquarium.
I totally support the vegan life style and think it's a wonderful thing though I do not partake in it wholly. That said my problem with the seal hunt is the same problem that I have with shark fin soup and whale meat.
Beef, chicken and pork are all sustainable and totally renewable. The form a staple part of the diet for many, many people and many, many animals. These animals are bred and raised for the sole purpose of providing a food source. I don't think anyone could argue that a hamburger or chuck steak is a luxury item, it's a food source and an inexpensive one at that. Is a ham sandwich a luxury or a chicken sandwich perhaps?
Shark fin soup is depleting a natural resource and risking the ecological hiarchey of our oceans in the process. Shark fin soup is a luxury item that wealthy Asian people use as a status symbol. It does not provide a major food source or dietary need to the people that consume it. It is a very wasteful and horrible practice.
Whale meat again is a luxury item that is depleting a natural resource. I have read countless articles by marine biologists and marine scientists speaking that the slaughter of great whales is wreaking havoc on oceanic eco-systems.
While it appears that seals are abundant they are being killed again for luxury items. From the videos I have watched and articles I have read these animals are skinned on the ice and the corpse is left rotting. Again these pelts are fashioned into coats that are used as a status symbol and serve a luxury purpose. I believe, no matter what any person says, that the seal hunt and bashing in of an animals skull is not humane. I also feel that the practices of certain slaughter houses and other agricultural industries are not humane either and I am in stark opposition to those as well.
I see the seal hunt as a robbery from nature, robbing an animal of life to provide a human being with nothing more then a lavish luxury item. From what ditch-diver has posted it provides a dual luxury for both those who buy seal pelt clothing items and the seal hunters themselves. Again as I stated earlier I feel that people who can run across ice flats and mash in baby animal's heads, then skin them (while some are still alive) should be spending their extra seal hunt money on a therapist. I couldn't myself do it. Perhaps it's because I was raised in a home where I was taught to respect animals equally as much as man. Perhaps it's because growing up I always had dogs, horses, fish, and the natural wildlife of my home front to keep my company and I have countless personal relationships with animals.
As I asked earlier how can you watch the seal hunt and not think of your family dog being in the position of the baby seal. Who are we to say it's alright in the case of the seal but not in other cases. A life is a life - human or animal. Kind of like what Horton said, "a person is a person no matter how small." If we must take an animal life to provide a NEED (like in the case of agricultural and the slaughter of animals as a food source) then I feel we must seek the most humane and moral ways to do that.
This isn't the stone age anymore. I am someone who feels man needs to try living in better harmony with his surroundings and a lot less killing needs to take place. The oceans are over fished by 60%+ - coral reef decline is accelerating and soon 80% of coral reefs will be gone - shark stocks and numbers of all large fish are over 80% gone - there will have been a greater environmental decline between 1980 and 2045 then there has been in the past 65 million years. I think it's pretty clear that man needs to change some of his more undesirable actions for the future's sake.
fisherdvm
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Yes, I was a veterinarian. My focus was on food animal. If you consider the egg industry, the hens are overcrowded, pushing the limit on animal per square foot (ie. 7 hens per pen, about 18 x 18 inches). Frequently their long curved toes get caught, and they are trampled to death while dying of thirst and starvation. When I used to walk these cages, I often find 30 to 40 dead hens a day. Piglets are weaned excessively early, and very stressed. They are housed in double stacker, and the top guys defecate and urinate on the one in the lower deck in crowded "nurseries". Pigs and calves are castrated without anesthesia, and so is dehorning. Veal calves are kept in small pens from birth till death - and can not walk, except to stand and lie down. Have you ever visited a feedlot, where cattle are fed unhealthy high calorie diet to achieve this very unnatural fattening we called "USDA choice" and are at the verge of metabolic disorder (fatty liver disease and liver abcesses).
No, the food animal industry is not pleasant. The life of a food animal is not good. We can do alot more for them. Before we focus unnecessary on the suffering of seals getting clubbed... I wished that some of the meat eaters here realize that you're a little hypocritical in ignoring the plight of the common farm animals.
Fisher,
I kind of figured the DVM stood for doctor of veterinary medicine. I agree with you that the life of food animals, whichever species they are is not pleasant. Though as I stated before I have seen situations where these animals were treated well and in good conditions, mainly on 4-H sponsored family farms.
The things my fiance has seen though and relayed to me are very disturbing especially concerning the plight of agricultural research animals. I'm sure when you attended veterinary school you saw some of these things first hand. My fiance is a vegetarian, she won't wear or eat any animal products but she does drink milk.
I kind of figured the DVM stood for doctor of veterinary medicine. I agree with you that the life of food animals, whichever species they are is not pleasant. Though as I stated before I have seen situations where these animals were treated well and in good conditions, mainly on 4-H sponsored family farms.
The things my fiance has seen though and relayed to me are very disturbing especially concerning the plight of agricultural research animals. I'm sure when you attended veterinary school you saw some of these things first hand. My fiance is a vegetarian, she won't wear or eat any animal products but she does drink milk.
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