Teen fatality - Skaneateles Lake, New York

[RochesterUE]

No disrespect, and it is a tragic event, but this is the AI forum. Discussions are intended to take place to understand the event, hopefully learning so as not to repeat.....

I agree, but unfortunately there are so few public details right now that any discussion is pure speculation at this point.

 

[DandyDon]

In this particular case, it means that both the other divers truly were experienced.

Unless you've been in their position, lets leave this space to share our condolences to Brandon's family and the local diving community. This should not be the place to second guess their experience level or decisions on a tragic dive. Thank you.

Brandon, rest in peace.

Thanks for the input. The news story tells so little, and then we wonder how accurate they are. I take it that no one knows why the young man bolted, nor why he didn't make it?

It was certainly a horrible accident. I read on another story that he and his mom had been diving together. However, per the Special Rules of this forum, Condolences are not allowed here, while we do have a Passings forum where you can start such a thread if you'd like: "(5) No 'condolences to the family' here. Please use our Passings Forum for these kinds of messages."

 

[RochesterUE]

Thanks for the input. The news story tells so little, and then we wonder how accurate they are. I take it that no one knows why the young man bolted, nor why he didn't make it?

It was certainly a horrible accident. I read on another story that he and his mom had been diving together. However, per the Special Rules of this forum, Condolences are not allowed here, while we do have a Passings forum where you can start such a thread if you'd like: "(5) No 'condolences to the family' here. Please use our Passings Forum for these kinds of messages."

Correct, it is not known why he suddenly made a rapid ascent. Lots of speculation at this point, but as someone who is very familiar with the case it is all just speculation.

My apologies, I was not aware of this rule.

---------- Post added October 26th, 2013 at 02:56 AM ----------

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/passings/468619-brandon-finch.html#post6930361

For condolences

 

[gypsyjim]

If one can not express their condolences while trying to also discuss the accident there is something very sad about the entire thread. Just my humble opinion of course.

While these A & I threads is not intended for family or friends, we should not forget that such people often do read them because they involve discussions about what may or may not have led to the passing of their loved one. I feel that we can at least show a bit of humanity and respect while discussing an accident.

 

[DandyDon]

If one can not express their condolences while trying to also discuss the accident there is something very sad about the entire thread. Just my humble opinion of course.

While these A & I threads is not intended for family or friends, we should not forget that such people often do read them because they involve discussions about what may or may not have led to the passing of their loved one. I feel that we can at least show a bit of humanity and respect while discussing an accident.

You weren't discussing the accident.

Condolences to the family. No one deserves to lose their child.

The rule is rarely enforced, other than maybe when that's all is posted, as typically a Mod has to just move the posts to a new Passings thread. It does help to read the Special Rules at the top of the forum, and abide by them. If you'd like to change them, there is a forum for that: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/feedback/

 

[lindenbruce]

If one can not express their condolences while trying to also discuss the accident there is something very sad about the entire thread. Just my humble opinion of course.

While these A & I threads is not intended for family or friends, we should not forget that such people often do read them because they involve discussions about what may or may not have led to the passing of their loved one. I feel that we can at least show a bit of humanity and respect while discussing an accident.

My guess would be yes and no. I understand the condolences part and people wanting to express themselves in such a way. But what if you were a family member reading a thread thinking is was dedicated to condolences and you were suddenly smacked in the face with postings to the contrary. I think that would upset the family even more not to mention the grief they were going through at that time. So, I can you your point, but I can also see the forum's point as well.

Besides, we only have the two dive buddies' word the victim made a rapid ascent and became unresponsive on the way to the surface. Hopefully an analysis of his computer, provided he was using one, will show what his true ascent was. Hum..... Maybe another good point FOR using a computer to help provide post dive analysis in such events. B.

 

[tanksforthememories]

I for one am very leery of diving in a group of three. Anyone else feel this way? Are there any stats as to wether this is a more risky configuration?

 

[DevonDiver]

Unless you've been in their position, lets leave this space to share our condolences to Brandon's family and the local diving community. This should not be the place to second guess their experience level or decisions on a tragic dive. Thank you.

As others have mentioned, this forum isn't the place for condolences. The aim here is to discuss incidents with a goal to identify lessons that will further contribute towards diving safety. It may be no great comfort for those directly involved in the incident, but the fact that 'some good may come of it' allows some measure of positive outcome to be attained, from an otherwise tragic event.

If one can not express their condolences while trying to also discuss the accident there is something very sad about the entire thread. Just my humble opinion of course.

While these A & I threads is not intended for family or friends, we should not forget that such people often do read them because they involve discussions about what may or may not have led to the passing of their loved one. I feel that we can at least show a bit of humanity and respect while discussing an accident.

I agree, but with the caveat that a full and frank discussion can be easily de-railed by emotional responses. The key factor is RESPECT. It is possible to respectfully analyse an incident - a key factor is to avoid the tendency to allocate blame to individuals and, instead, concentrate on the diving factors particular to the incident. Those factors would include; procedural and equipment causes, steps within the incident's "chain" and medical issues.

Pending (or in the absence of) hard facts, I don't think that speculation is necessarily a bad thing. That said, any commentary on A&I threads should be carefully considered for their educational value.

 

[DandyDon]

I for one am very leery of diving in a group of three. Anyone else feel this way? Are there any stats as to wether this is a more accident prone configuration?

I hate diving in threes. I suspect in this accident that the two older divers were both watching over the younger victim and just could not stop the accident, but in general - I find threes too challenging. Some others think that a three is ideal, but I hate having to watch over two others - and wonder if either is watching over me.

 

[tanksforthememories]

Thanks DandyDon I feel the same way. I wonder if the stats bear this out though? Does DAN keep records on this sort of thing?