Spin Off.. Is modern scuba gear more efficient today than 20 years ago?

[Thalassamania]

Rubatex suits work great ... California, the Northeast, up against the Arctic Ice and in McMurdo Sound, as well as everywhere in between.

 

[Hickdive]

I've yet to find a dry suit that is significantly better than my old Viking (with autodump and p-valve). The big advance there has been in undergarments.

Having worn out a Sport 90X and two HDs I still reckon Vikings were one of the most comfortable suits on the market. Unfortunately they simply weren't robust enough which is why virtually nobody in the UK uses them anymore.

I'm not convinced undersuits have improved that much, I bought my first thinsulate undersuit in 1986 and none of the replacements I've used in the intervening years has been signficantly warmer.

 

[Thalassamania]

Believe me, Thinsulate is a big advance over the woolybears and styrofoam like undergarments of the early days. Wearing out a sport suit I can understand, but two HDs? You sound like a candidate for a good set of chaps.

 

[Hickdive]

Believe me, Thinsulate is a big advance over the woolybears and styrofoam like undergarments of the early days. Wearing out a sport suit I can understand, but two HDs? You sound like a candidate for a good set of chaps.

Oh I do believe you, I tried two acrylic pile undersuits before I bought that first thinsulate, the difference was tremendous. I knew someone with the Viking open-cell undergarment but he didn't exactly rave about it. My only experience of the open-cell Viking material was the hood-liner for the dry hood on the 90X, it was alright but I didn't think a complete suit of it would compete with even my heavy-duty acrylic pile "woolly bear". I also knew someone who machine-knitted a woollen outer cover for an acrylic suit in attempt to improve it. It was an interesting site to behold

It was a common problem with HDs, I knew several other people who had them and we all had the same difficulty, the crotch seam would wear away the suit material either side of it and once that happened it was virtually impossible to patch. With the first HD I thought I was just unlucky but the second went in exactly the same way and with others suffering the same problem... well, we just stopped buying Vikings, as did everyone else and they effectively disappeared from UK diving. Lovely suit, just needed a constant supply of them

 

[DeepSeaExplorer]

As some one that started out with a bare plastic backpack sans even a basic horse collar, I agree on most all points...

But, I will say that two things have definitely been improved.

- Computers, I used a bend-o-matic (still have it on my desk right now) and then the Edge. (I can dive without them, but they definitely have their place.)

- Regulators, I over-breathed a old reg (70s vintage) on a deep dive years ago. That's also impossible with the new top-of-the-line regs now.

Most the other gear is little changed except for maybe a few minor improvements that for the most part don't improve functionality. In some cases, the new and 'improved' gear is even less functional than the older stuff. Today, performance and function is often confused with, and replace by, gimickery and gadetry.

Define efficient. Essentially the answer is no, it is less efficient.

The darling of the DIR/tech crownd, the Jet Fin goes back to 63, we were diving Jets before most of you were born.

The ScubaPro Shotgun snorkel is the best ever, everything since then is a weird contraption by comparison.

Masks are no better now than then and we used black, not clear, what makes a mask better?

The steel LP tanks we used were and are similar to what tech divers use today.

Double hose regulators like the USD Royal Aqua Master are more durable, more reliable than anything made today and perform as well with fewer maintenance.

Don't need no stink'n BC and a good horsecollar is more streamlined than all but the sleekest Oxy 18 pound, I know because I have them all and I have pool tested and timed swims backing me up.

Don't need no stink'n computer if you know the tables, tech/DIR divers today, the cutting edge, do not use computers, they use tables, so did we.

Plates, we used plates in the 60s, now Oxy Cheq has a Mini Plate of cordura, I ordred one, fits and feels a lot like a traditional harness or Voit SnugPack.

Weight belts, most tech/DIR, again considered leading edge, use a weightbelt EXACTLY like those we used in the 60s.

I can swim a vintage rig through the water as fast or faster than todays fluffy, padded poodle jackets, no, todays equipment in many respects is a step backward, it is market driven, not function driven.

BTW, UDT Duckfeet will open a can of whoop arse on Jets if you can kick them and they go back to the 50s.

This thread is an example of "antedotal."


N

 

[Thalassamania]

I never had that happen. My first Viking was an HD and it lasted forever (almost 10 years). I replaced it with a NATO suit, with the dog collar neck seal (black, intermediate weight, the wags about campus referred to those suits which were kinda trademark as "Darth's Waders"). I got six years plus out of each of the NATO suits, I still have one that I dive rarely and it's eight years old now. Maybe different countries, batches, etc.?

As some one that started out with a bare plastic backpack sans even a basic horse collar, I agree on most all points...

But, I will say that two things have definitely been improved.

- Computers, I used a bend-o-matic (still have it on my desk right now) and then the Edge. (I can dive without them, but they definitely have their place.)

Except for the package I find the EDGE hard to beat.

- Regulators, I over-breathed a old reg (70s vintage) on a deep dive years ago. That's also impossible with the new top-of-the-line regs now.

That was impossible with top of the line regulators (e.g., Cyclon 300) back then.

Most the other gear is little changed except for maybe a few minor improvements that for the most part don't improve functionality. In some cases, the new and 'improved' gear is even less functional than the older stuff. Today, performance and function is often confused with, and replace by, gimickery and gadetry.

Yup!

 

[captain]

Except for the package I find the EDGE hard to beat.

I think the Edge has the best display of any computer I have seen plus you can take a couple of pounds off your weight belt.

 

[Walter]

Is modern scuba gear more efficient today than 20 years ago?

Your question is flawed. Gear from 20 years ago is modern. If you want to compare today's gear with vintage gear, you have to go a lot farther back than 20 years.

Except for the package I find the EDGE hard to beat.

The only two problems with using an EDGE is it doesn't handle nitrox and you have to change the battery every other day.

I think the Edge has the best display of any computer I have seen

Nothing else even comes close.

 

[Nemrod]

Minimalism is a layered approach to meet the needs of the dive profile, not a one size fits all, always the same no matter how benign the dive.

Walter, thank you, yes, gear from twenty years ago is MODERN, you would need to go back two more decades and still, the answer is no. N

 

[Teamcasa]

Is modern scuba gear more efficient today than 20 years ago?

Your question is flawed. Gear from 20 years ago is modern. If you want to compare today's gear with vintage gear, you have to go a lot farther back than 20 years.

Flawed? It’s just my opinion, but it is hard to imagine that anyone would not consider today’s gear on par technologically with gear of 20 years ago. Maybe you have not been out looking but many things have improved significantly. From the materials used, manufacturing processes and designs used today are superior from the past.

Just because you refuse (and that’s your prerogative) to recognize the changes does not mean they don’t exist.

Minimalism is a layered approach to meet the needs of the dive profile, not a one size fits all, always the same no matter how benign the dive.

Walter, thank you, yes, gear from twenty years ago is MODERN, you would need to go back two more decades and still, the answer is no. N

N. Modern then, still good today, sure. I don’t find fault with people who love and use vintage gear or people who like the new stuff, the question was, is the new gear more efficient than gear made 20 years ago, not whether you like the new gear or not. I believe the new gear is more efficient and I for one like new technologies.

I am a confessed gear (and tools of most any kind) junkie. If I think it will make my hobbies, job or life easier, (much to my wife’s chagrin) I will explore it.