"Spare Air" - Experience in its use

[DevonDiver]

Yep...there just is no way to divorce a thread about spare air from a discussion about its merits.

The forum isn't just a Q&A engine for OPs. It is a community where divers come to chat and discuss issues. Whilst an initial post may be answered swiftly, there are often secondary questions and debates raised from it - and it just doesn't make sense to open an new thread for every sub-question and quick side-line that appears.

Congratulations, on sparking an interesting and informative debate

Personally, I just see no need for Spare Air devices.

I can understand the sentiment that "any extra air is better than none".... but in reality, there just isn't a situation that requires it.

If you need some redundancy of air on a dive you have the option of an adequately sized pony cylinder. Ponies are true redundancy for ascent. A Spare Air is just 'last gasp'.

Carrying a Spare Air for the purpose of making a dash to the surface, or to get to your (distant) buddy is really just throwing equipment into the mix to mask a more deep-rooted problem in your diving skill and awareness.

A well-practiced AAS drill and proper buddy skills really do cover all recreational diving OOA emergency scenarios. If you have doubt that your buddy would be close enough to share air with you, then perhaps you need to review and define your buddy drills prior to diving...or get a new buddy. 10-20 meters distance is not 'buddy diving', it is 'vicinity diving'.

I think the danger with Spare Air is that users have drastic over-expectations of the air supply gained from these gadgets. And, as you have so elegantly illustrated, this is directly responsible for leading them further into the spiral of sloppy diving conduct...and greater risk for themselves.

In short, Spare Air devices give their users a false sense of confidence. That, IMHO, is a dangerous thing.

 

[I Dive]

Yep...there just is no way to divorce a thread about spare air from a discussion about its merits.

The forum isn't just a Q&A engine for OPs. It is a community where divers come to chat and discuss issues. Whilst an initial post may be answered swiftly, there are often secondary questions and debates raised from it - and it just doesn't make sense to open an new thread for every sub-question and quick side-line that appears.

Congratulations, on sparking an interesting and informative debate

Personally, I just see no need for Spare Air devices.

I can understand the sentiment that "any extra air is better than none".... but in reality, there just isn't a situation that requires it.

If you need some redundancy of air on a dive you have the option of an adequately sized pony cylinder. Ponies are true redundancy for ascent. A Spare Air is just 'last gasp'.

Carrying a Spare Air for the purpose of making a dash to the surface, or to get to your (distant) buddy is really just throwing equipment into the mix to mask a more deep-rooted problem in your diving skill and awareness.

A well-practiced AAS drill and proper buddy skills really do cover all recreational diving OOA emergency scenarios. If you have doubt that your buddy would be close enough to share air with you, then perhaps you need to review and define your buddy drills prior to diving...or get a new buddy. 10-20 meters distance is not 'buddy diving', it is 'vicinity diving'.

I think the danger with Spare Air is that users have drastic over-expectations of the air supply gained from these gadgets. And, as you have so elegantly illustrated, this is directly responsible for leading them further into the spiral of sloppy diving conduct...and greater risk for themselves.

In short, Spare Air devices give their users a false sense of confidence. That, IMHO, is a dangerous thing.

I agree with everything you have posted here. But, there is one side of this never ending Spare Air debate that I haven't seen argued yet. Why does it have to be all or nothing with redundant air sources? Why is it that, if a redundant air source won't provide you enough gas to ascend normally, and maybe even also do a safety stop, that it's deemed useless? Why can't a tiny redundant source, such as Spare Air, be viewed as a CESA assistant? You run out of air, you notice you are too far from your buddy to get help from him, and you begin your CESA. If at some point during your CESA, your lungs feel like you have pretty much expelled all the air from them, you take one of the 5 or 6 breaths (or whatever minimal number) that are avail in the unit and you continue your CESA. Yep, a full size Pony is much better redundancy, but I can see a use for Spare Air as long as the user has the right idea in mind.

 

[DevonDiver]

Funny you should say that.... because that is exactly what I call them...a "CESA Bottle".

However, the problem still exists that they can give users a very real false sense of confidence...and consequently increase the temptation to deviate from good practice - because their buddy is no longer viewed as their 'lifeline' in an emergency.

Another issue regarding CESA on Spare Air is the time taken to deploy it. If you don't have one, you start immediately to the surface...and get there. If you have one, you spend vital seconds deploying it, steadying your breathing...and then CESA. I would question how much time... in a real emergency OOA,... it took an average, inexperienced diver to deploy the bottle and begin their emergency ascent.

In my mind, these contraptions make diving unsafer for their existence. If they weren't an option, then the any discerning diver would save their money and buy a proper pony bottle and regulator - giving them a true redundant air source for safe ascent. As it is, many people opt for Spare Air based on deceptive marketing and the issue of cost.

 

[halocline]

mattboy,
You quoted me:

And then said:

So now that you've called me a liar, explain what is untrue in what I said.

I didn't call you a liar, but if you want to make stuff up, fine. The lie that I was referring to is that "some air is better than none." It's a lie because, as I clearly said, it provides a false sense of security that will allow a diver to alter his/her behavior, rather than addressing the actual causes of (and solutions for) running out of air. People carry these things thinking that they will have a solution for an OOA situation when in fact they will not. That's far more dangerous than diving with the clear understanding that you are relying on gas management and proper buddy responsibility to safely dive.

 

[WD8CDH]

My experience:

I was given a Spare Air many years ago. I tried it for many simulated emergency ascents. From 30 feet, maybe, but even as quickly as it could be deployed, an immediate free assent was quicker. For 30 meters, no way, even the largest Spare Air is totally inadequate.

It didn't hold enough air to clear a tangled rope from a prop near the surface.

The best use I found for a Spare Air was to strap it on my Pony as a joke.

but.....I did recommend the Spare Air as Personal Protection Equipment for Oxygen Deficiency Hazard emergencies at work.

 

[TheScubaBOB]

I would say because getting to the surface is an all or nothing scenario.

If you've been down a 100ft (yes it's fair to make all judgments about Spare Air from 100ft as they advertise that to be it's MOD and we should never just look at something in the easiest situation) and need have an OOA situation getting to the surface is only half of the battle and CESA should be the absolute last resort. The other half is being safe as you get to the surface.

Why compare the Spare Air to a Pony Bottle? How about because they market it directly against a pony bottle and it is priced likewise. Don't sell me a Grape for the price of a Grapefruit, tell me it will satisfy my appetite as well as a Grapefruit and then expect me to only compare it to other Grapes.

Why does it have to be all or nothing with redundant air sources? Why is it that, if a redundant air source won't provide you enough gas to ascend normally, and maybe even also do a safety stop, that it's deemed useless? Why can't a tiny redundant source, such as Spare Air, be viewed as a CESA assistant?

 

[RJP]

Also it beats me how so many divers see no merit in have a second source of air, even to share with a buddy who desperately needs air beyond the second stage octp???

I think there's no one here who doesn't see the merit of having a second source of air. It's the specific CHOICE for that second source of air that many object to. If you want redundant air source get one that has ENOUGH air.

PS - part of me wonders if the OP realizes that "Spare Air" is a specific brand name for a little tiny tank, and not a generic term for "pony bottle."

 

[knotical]

I didn't call you a liar, but if you want to make stuff up, fine.

I didn't make anything up. I stated my opinion. You said it's a lie.

 

[ONESPEED]

Last week I had enough of buddy's wandering off and bought a "Spare Air" spare tank which now gives me some comfort of a second air source, ( to 30 metres). Unfortunately I have not had a chance to fully test this out.

I would be curious to know what others have found in testing it, but PLEASE - I really don't want arguments for and against use of pony tanks! I've already balanced this up and made my decision.

You don't need a spare air, you need a new buddy.

 

[mikerault]

Again, there are two sizes, I agree the 3 CF is not good for anything, but what about the 6 CF model? Which is being used and tested?