Shearwater coming out with new DC?

[buddhasummer]

For me, the screen, the battery, the electronic compass, bluetooth (minor but still a factor), the ruggedness.

For me, all that plus the reliability and exceptional customer service. I'm too old and poor to get into tec diving, rec till I die it will be.

 

[Scared Silly]

A Oceanic Veo 180($160.00) or even a Mares Puck($140.00) could do the same job but they are not Shearwater!!!

Sort of but not really. It is kinda of like driving a Nissan Versa vs Nissan Armada. Both will get you there but one has more features that makes the drive much nicer and more fun (and I am talking about just the rec aspects).

 

[Centrals]

Sort of but not really. It is kinda of like driving a Nissan Versa vs Nissan Armada. Both will get you there but one has more features that makes the drive much nicer and more fun (and I am talking about just the rec aspects).

First of all, I won't buy Japanese car. period.
Those unnecessary features on Shearwater would not make my dive any nicer and more fun!!! Because I only spend minimum amount of time looking at the computer! All I need to know are the depth, ndl and dive time. The colourful display on the Shearwater is nothing when compare with the kaleidoscopic underwater scene! So you enjoy looking at your Shearwater than the beautiful underwater scene around you!
You have probably forgot the reason why you decided to submerge underwater in the first place. Yes, enjoy your computer.
It is your holiday and money. Your choice. None my business.

 

[Lorenzoid]

So then why did you buy a technical computer and only run it dumbed down?

That's a fair question, and I can tell you. I bought mine after Shearwater introduced the Recreational Nitrox Mode, thereby turning what had been a "technical computer" into a computer that behaved just like the computers I had owned previously. The Petrel appealed to me because: (1) rugged construction; (2) large, bright display; (3) intuitive 2-button user interface; (4) company's stellar reputation for customer service; (5) well written manual; and lastly (6) I have to admit that the video on their website explaining the founding of the company resonated with me. All of this was night-and-day different from the computers and manufacturers I had dealt with before. The Petrel's rugged construction was immediately apparent--my old Suunto Zoop just always felt kind of junky. Sure, the Zoop may never have failed me during the kinds of relatively easy dives I do, but I just don't like the idea that they cut corners on its construction any more than I like that idea when it comes to other things I own. And if it had failed, I have read horror stories about Suunto customer service. Both of my Suuntos had screens that were so small as to become increasingly harder for my aging eyes to read. Their 4-button controls were difficult to use. Their batteries were not user-replaceable. Having used a computer at the extreme of having a small screen and a non-user replaceable battery is no doubt why I gravitated to the other extreme: a big colorful screen and a battery system so elegantly simple that I could change the battery to my heart's content and never be concerned I would be without power anywhere in the world. Granted, there are other computers out there that meet some, if not most, of these criteria. Computers with big, bright screens are now almost commonplace. Many have user-replaceable batteries. There are manufacturers with better reputations for customer service than Suunto. But it's the combination of all of the things I listed that led me to buy a Petrel.

To repeat what I have said previously, I don't consider running the Petrel in Rec Mode as "dumbed down." The intelligence--in software--is unlikely the major contributor to the Petrel's cost. Whether in Rec Mode or Tec Mode, it still has the same high quality hardware and is still made by the same upstanding company and, in my mind, should cost the same.

You couldn't find a much less expensive DC that would allow you to dive exactly the same way?

That could be said about lots of types of dive gear. More expensive does not necessarily mean higher performance. As I noted above, factors in my decision included more than just how it would "allow me to dive." Anyway, if we include "peace of mind" and general happiness with the product and its manufacturer within "dive exactly the same way," then no--I am not confident I could have found a much less expensive DC that would allow me to dive "exactly the same way."

Also, "much less expensive" means different things to different people. We're talking about a few hundred dollars difference, which is less than a plane ticket from Atlanta to Cozumel, and a heck of a lot less than a plane ticket to the Asia-Pacific region. It may even be less than the cost of my time if I were to find myself having to deal with a repair by an obstinate manufacturer. I am confident the Petrel will last me many many dive trips.

 

[lowviz]

That's a fair question, and I can tell you. I bought mine after Shearwater introduced the Recreational Nitrox Mode, thereby turning what had been a "technical computer" into a computer that behaved just like the computers I had owned previously. The Petrel appealed to me because: (1) rugged construction; (2) large, bright display; (3) intuitive 2-button user interface; (4) company's stellar reputation for customer service; (5) well written manual; and lastly (6) I have to admit that the video on their website explaining the founding of the company resonated with me. All of this was night-and-day different from the computers and manufacturers I had dealt with before. ...//...

Thank you for the time you spent on your reply.

Indeed, you did explain your position quite well. I completely accept and agree that your decision to buy a Petrel as a recreational DC was well considered. But your entire justification is contingent on the $750 price point being a non-issue for you.

Price was a non-issue for me too when I bought my Petrel. Even worse, I just spent well over a grand in gear just to be able to depth survey a mountain lake prior to diving it. How we spend our disposable income is not the issue here.

I realize that I hold a highly unpopular stand in this thread on recreational DC’s. Worse yet, I have absolutely nothing to gain by it. But I would still like to see Shearwater offer something to the average recreational diver, those with less deep pockets, in the $ 300-450 US price range as Shearwater's legitimate entry into the recreational DC market.

I’m quite certain that they won’t make such an offering. They have already found the outer limits of the recreational market and it appears that they can compete most comfortably there.

 

[Lorenzoid]

I've been enjoying the discussion, lowviz. I guess I am just a Shearwater fanboy now. I will add that I disagree with the assertion that the Petrel's price was a "non-issue" for me. Rather, when I weighed the things that I mentioned in my post appealed to me against the price, I decided the price was reasonable. Price was just as much an issue (a negative, if you will) to me as any of those other things I perceived as positives. We all have different thresholds, and we all give different things different weights in coming to our conclusions. Not everyone would come to the same conclusion.

Out of curiosity, who is this "average recreational diver" with "less deep pockets"? It seems to me the average (North American) recreational diver is the one taking trips to the Caribbean and Florida, and for whom the price of the Petrel is not SO off-the-charts that he would dismiss the idea of buying a Petrel over a $300 computer out of hand. Again, we're talking a difference of something like $400 between the unquestionably well-built and well-backed (by Shearwater) Petrel/Perdix and the cheapest dive computers available. And when the diver compares, say, a $500 computer with the Petrel/Perdix, the difference is that much smaller. I think the average recreational diver, to whom price is very much an issue, would still take a serious look at Shearwater computers.

 

[drrich2]

Reading recent posts, I asked myself whether it'd be in Mercede-Benz's interest to make a cheap car.

Many years ago, Hewlett-Packard put out a cheap line of printers...under another brand name (IIRC), and I believe Henderson puts out the Neosport line of cheap exposure protection wear. I've got a Henderson Aqua-Lok 2xl hood, and a Neosport 2xl hood. There is no comparison.

Seems like prestige brands making premium products don't want to be associated with cheap stuff, even when they do make it!

Richard.

 

[lowviz]

I've been enjoying the discussion, lowviz.

Same.

I've gotten quite a few new insights from all this.

Out of curiosity, who is this "average recreational diver" with "less deep pockets"?

Students.

I watch the new diver stream coming into my old LDS. There is usually a student involved somehow. They buy gear packages for scuba classes in school and maybe even win over a parent or two in the process. I guess they will all be getting either a Petrel or a Perdix now. Things could be worse.

But on second thought, my LDS has an informal association with a local large university. So like ScubaBoard, any conclusions to be had always have the potential for error due to a biased sampling of divers...

 

[dmaziuk]

---------- Post added January 7th, 2016 at 04:01 PM ----------

Reading recent posts, I asked myself whether it'd be in Mercede-Benz's interest to make a cheap car.

Many years ago, Hewlett-Packard put out a cheap line of printers...under another brand name (IIRC), and I believe Henderson puts out the Neosport line of cheap exposure protection wear. I've got a Henderson Aqua-Lok 2xl hood, and a Neosport 2xl hood. There is no comparison.

Seems like prestige brands making premium products don't want to be associated with cheap stuff, even when they do make it!

The story I heard about the Mercedes is they said (back in the 50s?) "we can make a car that will last you a lifetime, but will you want to drive the same car your entire life?"

The flip side is Yamaha had (still have) a "proper" line of amps/receivers they sold through authorized dealers IIRC the "RX" line. And a "cheap" "HTR" line you could buy from mail-order catalogs and "grey market" sellers. There was a FAQ someplace on Yamaha's website with the question what's the difference between the two. And their official answer was "white vs gold lettering on the front panel. There used to be a difference but then we realised that carrying two lines of essentially the same product costs us more than using the same better-quality components in both".

Edit: apologies for un-PC way of answering why someone living in SE Asia might have an issue with certain parts of said region.

 

[pafindr]

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