Seacraft GO! vs. Suex VR Voyager

[stuartv]

I also wondered about those 4 seconds, because I have a Go and had not noticed this "lag".

So I fired it up and video'ed the scooter spool up from zero to full speed. The video is attached - turn up the volume, you can hear when full speed is reached.

And for shits and giggles I did the same on the Genesis, video attached.

The spool up indeed took close to 4 seconds. That is not to say you are not going prior to that, just that full RPM's do seem to take about the 4 seconds mentioned.

The Genesis was faster to go from zero to full RPM's.

Turns out I can't attach videos, here are the links to the videos on my dropbox:

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

Yes! Thank you for posting. From the earlier posts, I had gotten the (wrong) impression that the Go! takes 4 seconds just to start going. Now I see that it starts immediately but takes about 4 seconds to ramp up to full power. That is definitely workable.

Also, it looks like your Genesis is a 3.x. And it's taking about 2 to maybe 2.5 seconds or so to ramp up to full power?

I just tried it with my Genesis 2.1. It seems to take more like 3 seconds to ramp up to full power.

The "spool up" on the Genesis is why I basically never unlock the trigger unless I'm clipping the scooter off. At least on my 1st generation it's far too slow.
Running the throttle with the trigger locked you get instant response.

If I'm understanding you correctly, you're comparing the Genesis where you either have the throttle (aka speed) set to Max (or whatever you want) and you're just starting and stopping by pressing and releasing the trigger, versus locking the trigger in the "pressed" position and then moving the throttle from Zero to wherever and back again to start and stop. Correct?

Your "1st gen" is a Genesis 600 or 1200? I.e. pre-Warp Core, aka pre-2.x?

I just tested that with my 2.1. Shot video of both and compared. It seems to take right at 3 seconds to get to full power no matter which way I do it. The sound of it ramping up is a little different between the two. But, the total time to get to full power seems to be the same.

If the Genesis 3.x ramps up quicker - as it seems to - that would definitely be a selling point (to me) for the 3.x vs a 2.x. The ramp-up speed on mine is totally acceptable. But, quicker would be nicer.

 

[grantmac]

Mine is a 1200. Certainly seems like the RPM follows the throttle much faster than just pulling the trigger. I basically only use the trigger as a lock when I don't have my hand on the handle.

 

[stuartv]

Mine is a 1200. Certainly seems like the RPM follows the throttle much faster than just pulling the trigger. I basically only use the trigger as a lock when I don't have my hand on the handle.

I could see how the programming might work that way. Just like if you hit Resume on your car, it accelerates up to speed at the rate built into the vehicle's electronics. But, if you use the gas pedal to accelerate up to speed, you can accelerate a lot faster.

Here is video of mine done both ways:

Trigger:

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

Throttle:

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

 

[grantmac]

My trigger is waaaay slower than that. Running throttle is similar or perhaps a little slower.
The older units were a bit lower voltage and also a less advanced controller.
I might send it in for an upgrade someday.

 

[RedSeaDiver2]

There is a reasonable lack of knowledge out there about can and can't be changed in the Seacraft menu's - and that is not the fault of the people using them but rather the lack of information from Seacraft. I will ask someone I know at Seacraft and see that I can find out about removing the slow start of the Go - it may be possible, it may simply be a function of what user mode it was in at the time.

A couple of things that I will mention - when the Go's came out there were a few issues with them even though the Go was Seacraft's 4th or 5th scooter - but now they are all sorted. The issue with the nose cone and people overtightening it was a function of people not reading the manual - which to paraphrase it says "use the provided tool to undo the nut on the nose cone - do not use the tool to tighten the nut - it only needs to be finger tight" - but as you have guessed people used the tool and overtightened it so they had to redesign it for those that didn't bother to read the manual - some of whom should have really known better seeing as they make CCR's for a living. So another thing to add to the comparison is how much sorting out and debugging / making it user proof the Go has had versus the new Suex - the Suex might be fine right out of the box and never have a problem, or it too might encounter a few issues along the way.

The other to consider is that the Go is magdrive - no shaft seal to worry about - like the Genesis.

Not sure if the OP is aware or not but there is a travel version of the Future as well - has 8 of the same batteries that the Go has 6 of.

 

[RedSeaDiver2]

OK here is the answer back from Seacraft -

The 'instant power' is known for the brushed motors, with no electronic control.

Multiple brushed motors with Hall sensor (constructions with motor inside the the hull, and shaft/transmission system) offer quite quick acceleration ramp.

In case of our motor construction, we do not use Hall sensors (what increases motor reliability), however every time before starting turning it has to synchronize. Currently, this is performed by a small 'rough' impulse which make a small motor movement. After this, controller knows what is position of the rotor, and can apply a starting sequence.

Synchronisation takes ~1-1.5s and this is felt by the users as 'lag'

In Future line, RPM and Torque motor steering are available. Torque offers much faster acceleration ramp. (different motor control mode)
In GO! only RPM steering is available. Also, synchronisarion in GO! is a bit longer than with Future.

I hope this helps.

Once I get my Future I will create some videos about various things such as using the ENC3 etc

 

[bradStyle]

OK here is the answer back from Seacraft -

The 'instant power' is known for the brushed motors, with no electronic control.

That's interesting to hear, as I had originally stated that the Seacraft lag was a function of the brushless motor, but many people thought that was incorrect. Perhaps I'm not understanding this as I should.

Synchronisation takes ~1-1.5s and this is felt by the users as 'lag'

Thanks to the very useful videos posted by @Jollymon32 it would appear to be four full seconds for the Go to reach its set speed.

In Future line, RPM and Torque motor steering are available. Torque offers much faster acceleration ramp. (different motor control mode)

In GO! only RPM steering is available. Also, synchronisarion in GO! is a bit longer than with Future.

From the videos posted it appears that the Future takes about 1 second less to spin up than the Go.

 

[bradStyle]

Here's a video we shot this afternoon of a Suex XJ spinning up. It will probably be another month at least until I can get my hands on a Suex VR to test this.

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

 

[Jollymon32]

Here's a video we shot this afternoon of a Suex XJ spinning up. It will probably be another month at least until I can get my hands on a Suex VR to test this.

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

Shaft is a deal killer for me. Why have a shaft when the technology exists to get rid of this potential for leaking.

 

[RedSeaDiver2]

Shaft is a deal killer for me. Why have a shaft when the technology exists to get rid of this potential for leaking.

Same for me - someone commented on the comparison that had been provided earlier and said that even though you couldn't compare manufacturer's specs like for like - there were things in the specs sheets that could instantly rule out a particular model - and a shaft drive is one of those - a shaft and its seals etc is just one more thing that can cause problems.

It will be interesting to see if anyone manufactures a scooter using a rim-driven thruster.