Rob Murphy Loses Legs to Boater

[Splitlip]

So why have we not put a fund together yet, and a plan to do severe damage to the doctor/boater who hit the diver.
The level of apathy represented by divers is disgusting.
Boaters pay little if any attention to dive flags, and to diver safety.
We represent a large enough group to create a "return threat" to dangerous boaters. They need to become afraid of dive flags, instead of ignoring the existance of them.

Are you people a bunch of wimps, or are you going to fight for your safety?
Dan Volker
p.s.
And I would be verry interested in doing legally justified "damage" to this doctor--and would contribute plenty of funds to such an effort....

Hi Dan.

I made the original post because I was surprised to see a lack of concern, let alone outrage on this board.

I frankly saw more on Scuba Toys forum which is made up primarily of MidWest and SouthWest Divers.

Honestly, there has been quite a movement on Spear Board, but I do not understand what I see here on Scuba Board. I know there a number of people here who do not care for Tony Grogan, the Spear Board admin, but really...I hope that is not the reason for the apathy.

Last weekend I went to marinas and the Blue Heron Bridge distributing petitions. I had positive responses about 25% of the contacts I made with divers. For the most part however, they did not know what I was talking about or could not be bothered.

Tim

 

[danvolker]

Hi Dan.

I made the original post because I was surprised to see a lack of concern, let alone outrage on this board.

I frankly saw more on Scuba Toys forum which is made up primarily of MidWest and SouthWest Divers.

Honestly, there has been quite a movement on Spear Board, but I do not understand what I see here on Scuba Board. I know there a number of people here who do not care for Tony Grogan, the Spear Board admin, but really...I hope that is not the reason for the apathy.

Last weekend I went to marinas and the Blue Heron Bridge distributing petitions. I had positive responses about 25% of the contacts I made with divers. For the most part however, they did not know what I was talking about or could not be bothered.

Tim

Tim,
I have this same problem with road cyclists....a car will hit one of us, and the cyclists are so passive that they do nothing to force recompense. And nothing ever changes--the legal system is not really set up to protect cyclists from motorists, any more than it is set up to protect divers from boaters. If you want this to change, the entire diving community needs to step up, raise money, and get attorneys to attack "dangerous boaters".

For this to work right now, we do need to know that the diver in question was near a diver down flag, and that the boat ignored the flag. If this happened, and then he went on to leave the scene, to me this is worthwhile creating a big legal ruckus.

For the apathetic of scubaboard----boats run over dive flags all the time in south Florida. One reason to use a good charter boat, is it having a captain with the balls to "play chicken" with any moron in a boat that is headed for a diver down flag.

For those of you who feel this is not your fight, think again. Even with a good charter boat, you could be run over by a jerk like this doctor. There is no legal plan to prevent this, save for nonsense like the marine patrol ticketing snorklers without flags just off the beach.
The marine patrol, on seeing dive boats on the reef, SHOULD be looking for boats cruising on top of the reef at speed, and clearly oblivious to divers. I have NEVER seen the marine patrol doing this, and without a huge backlash from divers on incidents like this, none of us ever will. And for a boater ignoring dive flags, there should be a punitive approach, much more like an automatic DUI conviction---no second chances, no appeals, no excuses for almost killing somone, or almost maiming someone. If the law treated boaters this way, you would see no high speed cruising on the reefs, while dive boats were out..Gee, that would be such a hardship for boaters--they would have to run a half mile further out, or a half mile further in, than the reef.

I have my own boat I dive with, a 34 foot Regal ( express cruiser). If I am running at 30 mph, and there were divers in the water ahead of me, I would find very little time to maneuver on seeing a flag in front of me, if the waves are anything over 6 inches. Sure, as long as you are careful to watch constantly, you can see the flag at the last moment, and then turn the wheel sharply, but finding yourself in this position is pretty stupid....the smarter play is to run off the reef, not on it. And if there are boats around a reef known for diving, then run well OFF the reef.
Obviously, the boat the divers are diving off of, needs a huge dive flag sticking high up into the air, but absense of it does not excuse recklass driving by a self indulgent boater.

Someone on scubaboard must be an attorney with some balls. How about posting on this issue, and creating a list of actions which we could consider.

Regards,
Dan Volker

 

[Speargirl]

You must NOT read the Headers here on ScubaBoard there has been a BIG Banner since this started to show ScubaBoards Support and get everyone involved. People here have put the word out not only in here but in there other forums they belong to. Dive shops all over the world have been contacted to support this as well. It is also in the News Letter this month here on ScubaBoard. ScubaBoard has shown a large amount of Support and so has the people who make ScubaBoard The Largest Diving Forum In The World.

On the court issue it's NOT how much money you have, It's the turn out at the court house steps that will make the difference. If we ALL ban together the large attorneys will follow and he will have the best attorney money can buy. Attorneys love this sort of thing) If a settlement is not made out of court than we can make a difference. We can all stand together at the court house to support our fellow diver. Other than that all we can do is try to get the word out by banning together and telling people about The Laws Of A Dive Flag and What A Dive Flag Means.

Rebecca

 

[Speargirl]

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/4144416-post62.html

 

[danvolker]

You must NOT read the Headers here on ScubaBoard there has been a BIG Banner since this started to show ScubaBoards Support and get everyone involved. People here have put the word out not only in here but in there other forums they belong to. Dive shops all over the world have been contacted to support this as well. It is also in the News Letter this month here on ScubaBoard. ScubaBoard has shown a large amount of Support and so has the people who make ScubaBoard The Largest Diving Forum In The World.

On the court issue it's NOT how much money you have, It's the turn out at the court house steps that will make the difference. If we ALL ban together the large attorneys will follow and he will have the best attorney money can buy. Attorneys love this sort of thing) If a settlement is not made out of court than we can make a difference. We can all stand together at the court house to support our fellow diver. Other than that all we can do is try to get the word out by banning together and telling people about The Laws Of A Dive Flag and What A Dive Flag Means.

Rebecca

Sorry,
I see the dive flag awareness banner as a complete waste of time....not only will the boaters ignore this campaign, most will never even know that there was a campaign.
And on the scubaboard site, the banner campaign is so unrelated to action relating to this last accident, my bet is that the majority of scubaboard members were not even aware of it!

For scubaboard members to be aware and motivated about this, you would have to see an active thread with lots of members discussing what can be done...If someone had posted something like "split fins are rip offs", you would have had several hundred internet divers suddenly take time to comment--whereas with this accident, the time spent is conspicuously absent.

Again, I would like to hear from attorneys on how we, as a group of divers, can "legally" attack this doctor, and any other boater who threatens or injures one of us.
Meanwhile, how about someone circualting a flyer with the doctor's photo and office address on it, with the "known, undispuited" facts of his disgusting behavior....certainly his patients and neighbors should have the right to know this about him? Again, this would need to be proofed by a good attorney to avoid problems for us, but absolute truth is a pretty strong defense, and one worth using here.

Dan Volker

 

[D2Diver]

I wish I belonged to SpearBoard as the love & positive energy being sent to Rob is so heartwarming that I feel I know him. Those are the posts I would want to be reading.

That said as one who doesn't post much there is rarely a day I don't think of you Rob & hope that it is a measure of comfort that so many people who don't know you care so much about you & your recovery. That is where most of us are focused-positive thoughts being sent your way. There are many, like myself, who read but don't post so don't think the Scubaboard community isn't there for you - we are. Trust me WE ARE!

Prayers & thoughts for a quick recovery
Deb

PS Can someone who is a spearboard member, fl-diver or speargirl?, send my message to Rob in case he doesn't read Scubaboard (which at this point I hope he doesn't -too negative sorry)

 

[scubadada]

Sorry, I apologize for my ignorance, where would be the best place for me to read about the objective facts in this case? The outcome was horrible, I would like to understand how it happened.

Most appreciatively, Craig

 

[Orlando Eric]

Here are my thoughts on the issues-

Divers are not talking about this or flocking to this board because they do not want to think about how this could be them. As a LEO we wear black bands on our badges and really do not like to put them on or think about how someone just like us just died. Many people you will find in true diving accidents will put the blame on the diver and thier lack of skills, training, or equipment. This is done because it insulates them from "being just like that guy" and sharing the same percentage of chance in death.

The flyer looks better than the one with the law cut and paste. Personally I find it still a bit too busy. I like the circle with the 300' zone on it. YOu want to be able to grasp the purpose of a flyer in under 6 seconds and complete it in under a minute. Now if you want lots of wordy wordys on it fold it or put that on the back. Mostly it is a read and toss thing which has to get the point across quicly and simply.

A petition for a national awareness day is nice if you are looking to honor the VICTIM in this case. If you want to make a difference send one to the State regarding the ridiculiously low fine for violating the law. The State is hurting for money and could possibly raise the rate. Recently riding your motorcyle on one wheel went up to over $1,000 1st offense and over $2,000 2nd.

A flyer with the DIVER FLAG AWARENESS -- the Diver Down flags -- The simple Oval Graphic -- and a nice $1,000 FINE would be an eye grabber.

 

[divedude1962]

From the point of view of legal action what can be done? And I don't mean in this particular case, since I think we can all relate incidents of boaters ignoring flags or (and this happened to me) grabbing a flag and dragging the diver, but in a larger sense. To make any legal action worthwhile it has to be not only legally correct, but also enforceable. In this case there are witnesses, and apparently the nitwit involved came forward on it, so it may be an easier case when/if it makes it to trial. But the question needs to be, what action to take? It's famously shown, everyday on the water, that boat operators obviously have not only no training, but also no discipline in their operation. So is the ultimate answer a law restricting boat operation near the flags/markers (we already have that) or lobbying for "real" punishments? I am a motorcyclist and we have the same issue: a car driver doesn't pay attention to what they're doing and turns in front of a bike, so the bike runs into them and the rider is killed. The car driver gets a ticket for an unsafe turn, but nothing else. Here we have the same issue: the laws and punishments don't reflect the actual results. So, again, what is the solution? I think the law as it stands is sufficient, and any action taken to inform boaters (and non-boaters) of the rules can only help, but we also need to write to the legislature for greater punishments and enforcement. Some of this will undoubtedly be limited by budget for water-cops, but I think in the end that approach will be more useful than vengeance against this one idiot. Though that will be greatly satisying.

 

[Splitlip]

You must NOT read the Headers here on ScubaBoard there has been a BIG Banner since this started to show ScubaBoards Support and get everyone involved. People here have put the word out not only in here but in there other forums they belong to. Dive shops all over the world have been contacted to support this as well. It is also in the News Letter this month here on ScubaBoard. ScubaBoard has shown a large amount of Support and so has the people who make ScubaBoard The Largest Diving Forum In The World.

On the court issue it's NOT how much money you have, It's the turn out at the court house steps that will make the difference. If we ALL ban together the large attorneys will follow and he will have the best attorney money can buy. Attorneys love this sort of thing) If a settlement is not made out of court than we can make a difference. We can all stand together at the court house to support our fellow diver. Other than that all we can do is try to get the word out by banning together and telling people about The Laws Of A Dive Flag and What A Dive Flag Means.

Rebecca

Becky:

I saw the banner and the thread Randy started. My post was made on 1/13. 4 days after the incident. Until then, there was little discussion. And Randy's post was 1/17. I was surpised at the apathy of the membership up until then

And Scubaboard membership is is on the magnetude of 100 times larger than that of the smalller boards. I guess I just expected more solidarity concern outrage discussion. Something.

Tim