Rescue Diver Gear Evaluation - Streamline vs Capability

[johndiver999]

You've donated your primary but how are you going to deflate your BCD during an ascent while buddy breathing if the Air2 is in your mouth?

We hear this often, but the question seems to arise from people who have never used that piece of gear (an Air 2). As others have mentioned, OFTEN the BC has a shoulder dump which can be used. However, even without any pull dump in the inflation hose or additional alternative dump, the answer is simple.

To vent air from the BC, you press the deflate button the same as any other BC. You might want to remove the Air 2 from your mouth when doing this, but it is not difficult at all. You are not inhaling from the Air 2 all the time. maybe half the time you are exhaling so removing from your mouth, pressing the deflate button while exhaling and then putting it back in your mouth is not a challenge. It literally takes less than 2 seconds.

Venting air while using an Air 2 (or similar device) should be practiced on every dive until it is simple and routine.

If that sounds too scary or too challenging, then I would not suggest a diver use such a device, but the reality of the matter is that deflating a BC while using an Air 2 is not a problem.

 

[Bowers]

my recommendation but do what feels best:
if/when you do change your gear, put the spg on an 18" or so hose that goes to your left hip so it is streamlined and out of the way. if you get rid of the octo then you'll need a primary donate setup with either a long hose (5'-7') or a 40" hose and an elbow before the second stage so you can route it under your arm. this allows you to use it in a streamlined fashion as primary but still long enough to donate your primary and you switch to the inflator/octo. (takes some practice to breathe it while managing bouyancy on ascent).

 

[hammet]

We hear this often, but the question seems to arise from people who have never used that piece of gear (an Air 2). As others have mentioned, OFTEN the BC has a shoulder dump which can be used. However, even without any pull dump in the inflation hose or additional alternative dump, the answer is simple.

To vent air from the BC, you press the deflate button the same as any other BC. You might want to remove the Air 2 from your mouth when doing this, but it is not difficult at all. You are not inhaling from the Air 2 all the time. maybe half the time you are exhaling so removing from your mouth, pressing the deflate button while exhaling and then putting it back in your mouth is not a challenge. It literally takes less than 2 seconds.

Venting air while using an Air 2 (or similar device) should be practiced on every dive until it is simple and routine.

If that sounds too scary or too challenging, then I would not suggest a diver use such a device, but the reality of the matter is that deflating a BC while using an Air 2 is not a problem.

I only brought up the Air2 thingy because it rings familiar. I took RD last year when I thought my 10 yr old daughter was going to get certified. I was partnered up with a young woman with an Air2 setup. Now she was not a very experienced diver so I'm not faulting the Air2 exclusively. However, she was confusing the whole which reg to donate thing and definitely botching the controlled ascent. Much of it can be chalked up to inexperience, (and also the fact that I was twice her size (muscles, not fat ), but for what it's worth, I am not a fan.

 

[johndiver999]

I only brought up the Air2 thingy because it rings familiar. I took RD last year when I thought my 10 yr old daughter was going to get certified. I was partnered up with a young woman with an Air2 setup. Now she was not a very experienced diver so I'm not faulting the Air2 exclusively. However, she was confusing the whole which reg to donate thing and definitely botching the controlled ascent. Much of it can be chalked up to inexperience, (and also the fact that I was twice her size (muscles, not fat ), but for what it's worth, I am not a fan.

The Air 2 requires a completely different mindset. If you are unsure if the diver actually knows how to use that piece of equipment, you might say before the dive, "if there is an emergency and I need your air.. I am going to take the regualtor from your mouth.. Right?"

If they give you a strange look, then you have been forewarned - this diver really doesn't know what the heck they are doing. The primary donate thing is a big deal.... NOT venting the BC..

 

[Jim Lapenta]

The other thing is that if you are holding onto a diver and need to dump with an air 2 using the shoulder dump on your bc, if it has one, is which hand do you let go of the victim with? Can you even reach the other shoulder dump with your left with a victim held up against you?
Another thing that seems to get confused in recreational rescue classes the more I see and teach them is that there is too much focus on getting someone up from the bottom and not enough on preventing the need to get them up in the first place.
Also, way too much focus on individuals doing the work instead of as a buddy team. While it is possible that a well-trained team will have a problem, the more likely scenario is that they will come upon a less well-trained diver that needs assistance and they can work as team to assist.
The other reality is that in the case of a missing diver underwater, it's not going to be recreational rescue divers that haven't practiced their skills since taking the class that does the work. It won't be a rescue it'll be a body recovery by professionals that do it.
The recreational rescue diver has little to no chance of performing a successful rescue of a missing diver underwater. On the surface with a panicked or tired diver? Yes.
This is why I'll teach the skills as required and a few more as well, but more time is spent on prevention.
Another consideration is that there are tons of people with rescue diver cards who really aren't. They haven't practiced a single skill since they got the card and use few if any of the prevention steps. If they were even taught them in a way that they remember over the physical stuff.
Real-world rescues are nothing like the class and the good instructor will make sure they know that many will not be rescues. They'll be recoveries. Focus on the prevention and put that ahead of worrying about physical skills it's nice to know but you will likely never use.

 

[Edward3c]

The Air 2 requires a completely different mindset. If you are unsure if the diver actually knows how to use that piece of equipment, you might say before the dive, "if there is an emergency and I need your air.. I am going to take the regualtor from your mouth.. Right?"

If they give you a strange look, then you have been forewarned - this diver really doesn't know what the heck they are doing. The primary donate thing is a big deal.... NOT venting the BC..

Do that and you'll have a panicked diver. Most divers will react as per their training in an OOG situation.

I used to have an AIR2 in place of an octo, to keep the number of hoses down.

All good and dandy until one day my SPG came away from the hose (poor maintenance and pre-dive check - my fault). My buddy had a similar setup, but refused to share air so I took their AIR2. Now I had both mine and my buddy's buoyancy controls.

I opted for a dedicated octopus before getting in the water again.

 

[Bob DBF]

Zeagle, Scubapro, I believe Aqualung all have pull dumps integrated into the inflator. Most use a cable inside the hose to activate it so you don't stress the corrugated hose - which actually won't work anyway.

According to advertising so does the Air 2. Probably depends on when it was bought, whether it has that feature.

Bob

 

[Bowers]

Do that and you'll have a panicked diver. Most divers will react as per their training in an OOG situation.

I used to have an AIR2 in place of an octo, to keep the number of hoses down.

All good and dandy until one day my SPG came away from the hose (poor maintenance and pre-dive check - my fault). My buddy had a similar setup, but refused to share air so I took their AIR2. Now I had both mine and my buddy's buoyancy controls.

I opted for a dedicated octopus before getting in the water again.

that sounds like a poor buddy... if you wear a combo unit you should be willing to use it and donate the primary (hopefully a longer hose to work with) for the better of the team.

on another note i teach my students from OW on, that the likely scenario when a diver runs out of air and is anxious/panicked is that they will grab the regulator that has bubbles (i.e. the one in your mouth), and that you should be prepared to let them have it and calmly go for your octo while stabilizing the situation.

 

[johndiver999]

Do that and you'll have a panicked diver. Most divers will react as per their training in an OOG situation.

I used to have an AIR2 in place of an octo, to keep the number of hoses down.

All good and dandy until one day my SPG came away from the hose (poor maintenance and pre-dive check - my fault). My buddy had a similar setup, but refused to share air so I took their AIR2. Now I had both mine and my buddy's buoyancy controls.

I opted for a dedicated octopus before getting in the water again.

The answer might be that the training is deficient. A diver who is using an Air 2 MUST be trained and practiced in donating the primary hose. I have no doubt that many people are NOT trained as well as they should be.

However, if you think logically about it, in this scenario, the Air 2 is really only a problem for the buddy. If you use an Air 2 and are trained and practiced and skilled in its use, then there is no problem should you actually have to use it. On the other hand if your buddy has an Air 2 and isn't trained properly and you need to take his primary, that could cause a significant problem.

I try to make a point of telling buddies that they MUST take the regulator from my mouth if they need air. More often than not, they scoff at the potential and I think many fail to understand that they MUST take the reg from my mouth. I always promise them that if they take the reg from my mouth, I will definitely notice right away.

 

[rongoodman]

All good and dandy until one day my SPG came away from the hose (poor maintenance and pre-dive check - my fault). My buddy had a similar setup, but refused to share air so I took their AIR2. Now I had both mine and my buddy's buoyancy controls.

Why would a disconnected SPG lead to air sharing? As I recall it takes over 20 minutes to empty a tank through an HP hose.