Rental Truck Vandalized

[gypsyjim]

Nice troll

 

[Lorenzoid]

Is there something similar to Godwin's Law that says sooner or later someone gets called a troll?

 

[dfx]

Is there something similar to Godwin's Law that says sooner or later someone gets called a troll?

We could call it gypsyjim's law.

 

[gypsyjim]

I'm wondering which one of you assumed you were the troll, as I named no one.

---------- Post added April 24th, 2014 at 05:31 PM ----------

What is quite humorous, and yes even quite ironic, is that I called no one either a troll or a drama queen.

I simply responded to T C 's comment, after Richard ' summary, that the discussion was over.

I merely suggested that unnamed trolls and drama queens would probably think differently. I can not help it if some of you came along and decided that those troll shoes were yours, and put them on your own feet.

 

[T.C.]

How many people are going to file a police report for stolen flip flops, shirts, towels etc.?

But how often are these items intentionally stolen?

The one time I was robbed, (which was my own fault for not enforcing the anti-theft measures on new Bonaire divers), they left room keys and reading glasses, yet took my friend's bag and my zipped up camera bag. They took these because they thoughtthat there may be something valuable in the closed bags.

They left all the stuff, and stole on possibility. I doubt there are many thefts of these low value items.

I've noticed that you have claimed this a few times, and I don't know enough about it to either agree with it or refute it. However, I read a lot of forums on Scubaboard, and I have never seen a vacation destination where there are more complaints about crime. Do you have any thoughts on why that is? Are people that go to Bonaire a bunch of whiners?

It's because they have the expectation of paradise, and a carefree vacation. They check their common sense at the customs station, then are suprised and angered when they become the victim of petty crime...when simple, common sense measures would prevent that. Don't want to lose your land camera while diving? Don't take it, or hide it well. But people expect to just leave it laying around and nothing to happen. Don't want a robbery at your house? Lock the door, use your chain, lock the windows, and drop a lock bar on the sliding door. But people expect to be able to just leave their place unlocked and that nothing will happen to them.

When you say "very low", that would imply to me that it is almost non-existent, but that doesn't seem to jive with what I've read on SB. I wouldn't use the phrase "very low" to describe the crime in Cozumel either, but my impression is that it is lower than Bonaire.

It's not "non-existant", but it is low. It doesn't happen often, or is common. That's why losing something cheap suddenly becomes a big deal. Cozumel is also different. The resorts are large, walled, and secured. People boat dive, and don't take trucks everywhere. They know that crime is high in Mexico, and don't turn off their common sense while on vacation.

I have to wonder if Bonaire visitors' "expectations"--which have led to so much bad press here and on Tripadvisor, Undercurrent, etc.--are based in part on a nostalgic feeling for what Bonaire is "supposed to be like" in their minds rather what much of the Caribbean is in reality like (or becoming) today.

That's EXACTLY what the issue is. People like Mike expect perfection, and when their expectation is disrupted, they don't accept that there are still humans there, and that crime exists wherever there are humans.

Might, say, Roatan be a better comparison? Crime has been increasing there, too, from what I've read and heard.

Roatan has walled resorts, often with armed guards. Our guards had revolvers, a shotgun and an M16 in their shack. We were warned not to go out alone or in small groups to the town, and stay in the tourist areas when we did.

I've never seen a gun on Bonaire, except at the airport (and I quickly notice these things), and considering all the times I've been lost in Rincon, never been warned to stay out or travel in large groups.

 

[Mike]

I merely suggested that unnamed trolls and drama queens would probably think differently. I can not help it if some of you came along and decided that those troll shoes were yours, and put them on your own feet.

Well I say - This thread is filled with insightful and thoughtful information provided by intelligent posters.

(new shoes for anyone to put their own feet into)

 

[mikeycanuk]

If it wasn't for those who defend XXXXXX to the ends of the earth that their favourite place is Eden, SB would be a boring place.

Bad s@@t happens everywhere, some places far too much, so I (and others) don't go.

The end.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[gypsyjim]

Well I say - This thread is filled with insightful and thoughtful information provided by intelligent posters.

(new shoes for anyone to put their own feet into)

If the shoes are comfortable on your feet you are welcome to wear them.

 

[parachute]

Because Lorenzoid knows that People are People. All around the world, there are humans with flaws. People don't become perfect because you want to visit their home. Crime happens; your views that there should be no crime are unrealistic, naive, and silly.


Bonaire is not some crime ridden ghetto, and it is far better than Jamacia, Mexico, Thailand, Roatan, Eygpt or dozens of other destinations around the world. It is better than most islands in the Caribbean. But this isn't good enough for you; you expect there to be zero crime, and that you can ignore common sense, and leave your gold bars on the front seat of your car while diving.

Well, until you can fix the problem of people being people, this won't happen. Till then, you can be angry and upset, insulting and swearing at everyone, but the rest of us will accept that crime may happen, and take common sense means to prevent it.

And I guarantee we'll have a better vacation than you.

People are people?.....

When Bonaire island tourism was in its infancy, one of its pioneers and visionaries, Don Stewart (aka Captain Don) did not accept the problem nor excuse of "people being people" when they would drop anchor onto the reef or break off coral for souvenirs. His refusal to accept this was a major part of the birth of the Marine Park and status & attraction of Bonaire as a "Divers Paradise".

 

[T.C.]

People are people?.....

When Bonaire island tourism was in its infancy, one of its pioneers and visionaries, Don Stewart (aka Captain Don) did not accept the problem nor excuse of "people being people" when they would drop anchor onto the reef or break off coral for souvenirs. His refusal to accept this was a major part of the birth of the Marine Park and status & attraction of Bonaire as a "Divers Paradise".

This is a totally inapt comparison. Boat operators and divers are not criminals and know right from wrong, so this is totally inaccurate.

One: Boat operators and (most) divers are people who will fundamentally obey laws. You pass a law banning anchoring or coral collection, and they will obey it; especially when an alternative is provided, i.e. mooring buoys.

Criminals, by definition, do not obey laws. You can pass all the laws banning crime, and criminals will still do it.

Two: Anchoring was the only way of mooring boats at dive sites. Put in the alternative, and they gladly used it. There is no providing a criminal with an alternative to crime.

Three: Anchoring and coral collecting was considered not very harmful. We have learned and progressed since then, and now this practice is frowned on; so most people avoid it. We fundamentally want to do what is right.

Criminals don't care about what the consequences of their actions are, nor do they feel compelled to progress away from crime. They fundamentally do not want to do what is right.

Four: Divers are a small community, and easy to identify and educate. Boat operators are even smaller, and well known. It’s easy to reach out to this group.

Criminals by their very nature are hard to identify and modify their behavior. You have to catch them in the act, and the terrain of Bonaire makes this very difficult without intensive resources and effort.



People are people. You will never eliminate crime, and there is always a risk of it, even in Bonaire, where that risk is very low. It’s just that people expect there to be no crime, and are shocked and angered when humans in paradise turn out to have the same flaws as the humans at home.

You can change and modify the behavior of people who want to avoid doing harm. This is easy to do in the case of the boat operators and divers. We can educate them and show them the benefit, long and short term, to not harming the coral. They comply because they are not criminals, they know right from wrong, and want to do what is right. Criminals do no care about doing harm; and it is difficult to change them. We effected this change in Bonaire in a few decades. Humanity has been trying to eliminate crime since the time of Hammurabi. It has yet to eliminate crime. People, after all this time, are still people.