Regulator configuration for recreational diving

[Bob DBF]

90% if not 99% of single cylinder kit configurations are single cylinder ,BCD, Standard regulator and octopus (on a slightly longer hose).
The are taught, in an OOG situation, go for the Octopus.

This may be the case in the UK, as the BSAC teaches and requires that configuration. In the US there are a lot of Air 2’s and their clones in use, so the “standard reg and alternate” has less of the market here. The training is modified to account for the differences in equipment used.

The local instructor I did some training with makes a point in all his classes to go over different configurations and the importance of knowing your buddy’s configuration and OOA procedure.

In AOW, he and I had a long hose configuration (mine was 40”, his was 7’), and the rest of the class was evenly split between the standard configuration and Air2. From what I saw of the other classes, over a few years, was Air2 in the minority but not by much, and the instructor being the only long hose.

At that point, he was doing AOW and specialties, and the instructor he had trained did all the OW. Different configurations were in the training because different configurations are in use here.

 

[scrane]

Obviously, regulator configuration is one of the things you go over with a buddy, particularly a new one, before you hit the water

But if you're out of air everybody is your buddy.

 

[scrane]

I am not trying to intrude on the latest fashion of regulator wear, I'm just trying to make the point that standardization of emergency protocols is probably a good thing. Personally, I have never seen a problem with traditional octopus carry. Now, specialized technical diving might require a different standard, but for general recreational diving I would prefer another diver to have the octopus where I was trained to expect to find it.

 

[Gareth J]

This may be the case in the UK, as the BSAC teaches and requires that configuration. In the US there are a lot of Air 2’s and their clones in use, so the “standard reg and alternate” has less of the market here. The training is modified to account for the differences in equipment used.

Funnily enough - I wasn't thinking of the BSAC training, because branch training tends to mean a quick migration away from single cylinder diving because of the environment. [1]

I learnt in the Red Sea. Like most European divers, I've dived the Red sea a lot. Thailand & Malaysia, and of course the Mediterranean (mainly Malta). I have limited diving experience in the USA, mainly California.
I have friends who work or have worked in the diving industry in the Red Sea, Indian Ocean, Caribbean and Australia.

My comments where based on that information, and the hire equipment I see.

I did notice in California a number of AIR2's in use by experienced divers, which was quite a shock, but they didn't appear on the hire kit.

[1] we have to teach quite a lot of configurations because of the diversity of kit in the branch.

 

[KenGordon]

In AOW, he and I had a long hose configuration (mine was 40”, his was 7’)

I would not call a 40in hose a long hose. That is a normal octopus hose length. There is also confusion about short hoses. Is that like 24in (twinset backup fashion) or 36in like a typical primary comes with out of the box?

 

[MichaelMc]

I am not trying to intrude on the latest fashion of regulator wear, I'm just trying to make the point that standardization of emergency protocols is probably a good thing. Personally, I have never seen a problem with traditional octopus carry. Now, specialized technical diving might require a different standard, but for general recreational diving I would prefer another diver to have the octopus where I was trained to expect to find it.

The thing is the backup reg is not just for other people, is is also for me. There may be differences between 1) what you were trained to expect (say an octo), 2) what others where trained to expect (say primary donate), and 3) where I'd like my spare reg to be (say a necklace under my chin). And the odds of each person needing it: you, my buddy or me. I like my backup under my chin, I know it is there right by my mouth. And primary donate seems to work well for the folks I have as buddies. If I see you coming I'll give it to you. I'm fairly sure 'reg offered in hand' trumps 'find octo on their body'.

We do not need to start a primary donate debate, particularly with covid, there is a thread on that. But having a backup reg is not just for the other diver.

 

[Bob DBF]

I would not call a 40in hose a long hose. That is a normal octopus hose length. There is also confusion about short hoses. Is that like 24in (twinset backup fashion) or 36in like a typical primary comes with out of the box?

I use 40” as generic, not 5’ or 7’, mine is a bit longer, because the 40” hose was a bit short for the routing, and that hose is used as the primary. I suppose I could call it a longer hose, but I doubt that would cut down the confusion. My alternate is less than 30” on a bungeed backup.

I’d have to go measure, but until I have a date go diving, it just makes me sad to go in the dive locker.

I have tried most configurations and use this one. I have nothing against 5’ or 7’ primary hoses but they are not optimal for my use of a snorkel.

 

[RogueClimber]

ERRRR..... this is about single cylinder diving.

90% if not 99% of single cylinder kit configurations are single cylinder ,BCD, Standard regulator and octopus (on a slightly longer hose).
The are taught, in an OOG situation, go for the Octopus.

As I have said, I don't normally dive single cylinder. But the way I dive single cylinder is because I come at it from Twinset diving (as do most of those commenting here).

NOT "the way the world dives" (copyright PADI et al)!

If we are honest, most of those holding a diving qualification have never progressed beyond single cylinder, BCD, and the standard regulator configuration.

We (Scubaboard) are proportionally insignificant in comparison compared with the majority of those holding a diving qualification. That said, we are having fun , so press on.

Are you aware that SSI teaches primary donate?

I don't have the numbers (so won't make any up) but I would think that might lower your 90%-99% number a bit

 

[Gareth J]

Are you aware that SSI teaches primary donate?

I don't have the numbers (so won't make any up) but I would think that might lower your 90%-99% number a bit

As do GUE.

I have no idea of the numbers either. But I strongly suspect there are far more divers trained not using primary donate, than using primary donate, just based on the lack of long hoses on scuba sets.
I don't have a problem with primary donate, when I dived twinsets I was comfortable with primary donate. I just accepted that the majority don't do primary donate.
As I have said previously, on the 4 occasions I had to donate for real, I actually handed off a regulator to my waiting buddy, we new we had an issue before it was no gas left.
On the two occasion i required a regulator from my buddy, one buddy handed one off to me because we both new the problem was unfolding, the other occasion I actually tapped my buddy on the shoulder, signalled I had a developing gas problem and he handed over a regulator (he was confused - he wondered why I was running a drill at that depth on that wreck).
As the Chairman says, there is no excuse for just running out of gas, you have a contents gauge, take a look at it occasionally.

If you are practicing primary donate, you also need to accept that there are an awful lot of people who don't know what it is, or how to do it.

 

[loosenit2]

Are you aware that SSI teaches primary donate?
I don't have the numbers (so won't make any up) but I would think that might lower your 90%-99% number a bit

I have read SSI instruction standards (below). It would appear that SSI does teach primary donate, but the rational is not because it is superior, but because "passing the primary works with most equipment configurations" which is a practical reason; to prepare students for all eventualities. It also allows all instructors to decide which method they will teach in entry level programs, primary donate is only required as the standard for professional level programs.

I also did a little research on Mares Regulator sales. Most of their regulators are sold with a standard 29.5" hose, not the 22-24 inch hose that is more common with primary donate. Mares also offers at least 8 variants of Octo second stages.

All this leads me to believe that SSI may familiarize and in some cases teach primary donate their heart is not really in it and it is probably not as widespread as many would think it is within SSI.

I routinely dive with a club that is run from an SSI shop, none of the club or the owners of the business or his divemaster run primary donate systems. I occasionally insta-buddy with several members of the club, I always have to explain I am using primary donate and what it means to them.

Of course this is, like everyone else's stories, anecdotal, but not a lot of systematic surveys out there on equipment configurations outside of SB. Which as @scubadada survey's show are heavily tilted towards long hose and tech diving configuations.

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From SSI Scuba Standards:

Teaching Air Sharing Skills For entry-level SSI programs, SSI Professionals may teach either method of air sharing (passing the primary or passing the alternate regulator).

a. Air Sharing Skills During Entry-Level Training Due to the wide variety of equipment configurations, SSI encourages SSI Professionals to teach both methods of air sharing to entry-level divers. As dive professionals, we have an obligation to provide students with the knowledge and training necessary to dive autonomously with an equally- or more-qualified buddy in environments consistent with their training.This includes equipment configurations they may encounter in equipment they purchase, rent, or see on their buddy.

b. Rationale For Passing The Primary Air Source There are four common Delivery System configurations in modern recreational scuba:
A first stage and primary second-stage with a traditional alternate air source (additional second-stage regulator)
A first stage and primary second-stage with an integrated alternate air source and BC infIator
A first stage and long hose primary second-stage with an alternate air source (additional second-stage regulator) on a necklace
A first stage and primary second-stage, and an additional first stage with alternate air source (additional second stage regulator)

c. Air Sharing During Professional-Level Training: Since passing the primary works with most equipment configurations, it is SSI's preferred method, and is a required and evaluated skill for all SSI Professional training programs.