Recreational Pony Bottles, completely unnecessary? Why or why not?

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BoltSnap

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Some situations you simply will not manage on your own and to not know that is a fatal mistake.

Such as?

I can't imagine that I'd do a dive where I am going to die because I can't manage the dive on my own and I'd need somebody else to bail me out. Screw that, I won't do the dive. ESPECIALLY in recreational diving.
 

mac64

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Such as?

I can't imagine that I'd do a dive where I am going to die because I can't manage the dive on my own and I'd need somebody else to bail me out. Screw that, I won't do the dive. ESPECIALLY in recreational diving.
Any danger of getting entangled. Which would be any site you don’t know. Yesterday I was searching a site with a metal detector in only 30 feet and after getting a signal under a large boulders I dug in to arms length but had to leave it as I was solo and without a buddy or standby it was to dodgy to continue. It would be crazy to drop into any unknown wreck in any kind of poor vis on your own or without a standby. This idea that because you’re within rec depth your safe is madness. Last week clearing a large tree from a mooring in 15 feet a branch which I was 100% certain I had cut but had missed in the dirt treaded itself straight down between my first stage and my back when I went underneath to get a cable to the tree. I had to take my gear off to get out in complete black. You’re not safer on your own you have to be a lot more careful.
 

Ucarkus

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That is fine with me, if some people would stop demonizing those that prefer self sufficiency., which is what normally starts these never ending threads. Split fins anyone.
The key word here is prefer.
There is absolutely no evidence or data that diving with a pony will make you safer. This is the reason these threads last forever because it is hard to influence other peoples believes or preferences and they often become defensive.
There is more fatality among solo divers. Solo diving or self reliant diving does not make you safer. You accept more risks in fact.
There is more fatality among tech divers. Tech divers work as team btw, just like rec diving teams. You also accept more risk.
Carryover the practices from other types of diving that are solving very different risks/probabilities is not making rec diving safer or in anyway better.
 

happy-diver

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you are only as smart as your stoopidest associate
 

Nemrod

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There is more fatality among solo divers. Solo diving or self reliant diving does not make you safer. You accept more risks in fact.
.
I would be surprised if that were actually true. Do you have the statistics to back that up? A solo dive is not a buddy team that is accidentally split and they are now by themselves nor is it when a dive planned as a buddy dive and by some decision process becomes a solo dive impromptu with neither buddy trained for or equipped for a solo dive. Those instead are buddy dives gone wrong. If such dives (with accidents resulting) are included in the stats it alters the data.

A solo dive is a planned dive as solo and the diver is equipped both in training and equipment for the dive. It is not a buddy dive gone wrong. I doubt in any way it can be supported that planned solo dives are more dangerous than a buddy dive, especially given the sorts of buddies you guys talk about in this thread.

James
 

Wibble

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I would be surprised if that were actually true. Do you have the statistics to back that up? A solo dive is not a buddy team that is accidentally split and they are now by themselves nor is it when a dive planned as a buddy dive and by some decision process becomes a solo dive impromptu with neither buddy trained for or equipped for a solo dive. Those instead are buddy dives gone wrong. If such dives (with accidents resulting) are included in the stats it alters the data.

A solo dive is a planned dive as solo and the diver is equipped both in training and equipment for the dive. It is not a buddy dive gone wrong. I doubt in any way it can be supported that such dives are more dangerous than a buddy dive, especially given the sorts of buddies you guys talk about in this thread.

James
Do you not treat all dives as solo dives whether or not you're diving with others? Meaning that if the fan is struck by Le Merde, all's cool.
 

Nemrod

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Do you not treat all dives as solo dives whether or not you're diving with others? Meaning that if the fan is struck by Le Merde, all's cool.

No, I do not. I treat a buddy dive as exactly that and my buddy is an integral part of the dive plan and acts as my back up gas among other things. No, I do not. When I solo dive I am equipped differently, I have a different plan, it is a different dive.

And that is why we are now at 61 pages, some folks do not trust the buddy system or their buddies and feel they must augment it with a pony bottle and some folks believe the buddy system is adequate for recreational diving as it has been since the beginning of SCUBA instruction.

James
 

tursiops

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Any danger of getting entangled. Which would be any site you don’t know. Yesterday I was searching a site with a metal detector in only 30 feet and after getting a signal under a large boulders I dug in to arms length but had to leave it as I was solo and without a buddy or standby it was to dodgy to continue. It would be crazy to drop into any unknown wreck in any kind of poor vis on your own or without a standby. This idea that because you’re within rec depth your safe is madness. Last week clearing a large tree from a mooring in 15 feet a branch which I was 100% certain I had cut but had missed in the dirt treaded itself straight down between my first stage and my back when I went underneath to get a cable to the tree. I had to take my gear off to get out in complete black. You’re not safer on your own you have to be a lot more careful.
"Recreational" is more than depth....entering an unknown wreck, for example, is not recreational diving. What you are describing is dangerous diving...and usually commercial.
 

Wibble

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No, I do not. I treat a buddy dive as exactly that and my buddy is an integral part of the dive plan and acts as my back up gas among other things. No, I do not. When I solo dive I am equipped differently, I have a different plan, it is a different dive.

And that is why we are now at 61 pages, some folks do not trust the buddy system or their buddies and feel they must augment it with a pony bottle and some folks believe the buddy system is adequate for recreational diving as it has been since the beginning of SCUBA instruction.

James
Largely depends upon conditions and personal attitude to diving.

Most of my diving's done in mediocre visibility and poor light. Frequently this can be down to less than 1m/3'. Buddies are hard to keep that close. Thus should crap happen, it's down to me to resolve it. Thus it's a habit of always having redundancy, be that a spare mask, spare SMB or gas (twinsets or sidemount).

If you're diving in great visibility this probably isn't such an issue and if you're comfortable to rely on your buddy, that's cool.
 
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