Prayer is useless?

[00scuba]

Ray Comfort wrote a great book titled, "God doesn't believe in atheists"

Buy it here:
http://www.livingwaters.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=104

It provides proof that the atheist doesn't exist.

That is hiliairous...lol Just goes to show you he loves everybody...right? Is that in the sci-fi section?

 

[plankspanker]

There are none so blind as those who will NOT see.

As for the article...a hint for the helpless...You have to believe.

FACT: The native Americans never saw Columbus' ships arrive. They sailed right in un-noticed until they were physically verifiable. They had no previous knowledge of them, and simply did not see them. Research it!

How many blessings blew by YOU today:06:

Please explain this more because I don't think I understand this and I have no idea how to put that in a search engine.
This is how I am reading it:
A Native American is staring out over the ocean and a ship comes into view, a large solid object floating on the water, and because he had never seen anything of the sort before that it was invisible to him??? I could see them not being concerned with a ship because they didn't know the potential impact of a boat full of white men but that isn't the same as not noticing them at all.

 

[Green_Manelishi]

perhaps we could turn the tables and say that those who believe in a god "don't get it". That this is our life...and we should concentrate on the now and what we can do to make it a better place, treat people kind and respectful because that is the right thing to do. Not to make sure there is a place for you later.

It is an interesting topic....and I am sure most feel very strongly one way or the other...which has to do with an experience, childhood, respected people in their lives.

Perhaps when each of our days come to an end...we will have the answer....

Yes, treating people well is the "right thing to do" but why? Whose standards? Society? If there is no moral absolute their is no standard against which to judge right and wrong.

Besides, holding your place at the end has nothing to do with how you behave, it has to do with who you trust to hold your place.

When days come to an end is like handing in a test at the end of class. The die is cast. No second chance, you pass or fail.

If, as you believe, there is no God then all I believe is irrelevant and all I did and am will amount to nothing. If, as I believe, there is a God then many are in trouble at the end of the test.

God bless.

 

[jepuskar]

Prayer is helpful for the individual and is only helpful if it motivates that person to do whatever they need to do. If it provides hope for that individual when they are too weak to believe in themselves or to cope with lifes events, then it is helpful. It is also helpful for others if they know people are praying for them because it gives them hope etc....

This is the only benefit of prayer. Those who can motivate themselves and can deal with lifes sometimes horrific events don't need to pray to some fictional character. Look at the latest tragic accident in West Virginia. I was up when the good news came over that the miners were alive and they quoted people saying it was because we prayed for them etc etc. They broke out into prayers and songs of religion....come the morning I heard none of this, all I read was how angry people were that misinformation was giving to them. Nobody was talking about praying then or how their prayers helped them.

It is such a two way street. It is really ridiculous. Prayer gets nothing done, you have to take action yourself or get others to take action....that is what gets things done.

I've gotten into many arguments about this before, what usually happens is that religious people don't respect my viewpoint and some actually say they are sorry I don't believe or that I am soo misguided. They also offer assistance to help me find the way. And even though I am completely on the opposite side of the spectrum from these people I always show courteousy and respect that they found something in their lives that works for them. I don't tell people I'm sorry they need to pray or I'm sorry you believe in something that doesn't really exist.....if it works for you, great.

J

 

[00scuba]

"Yes, treating people well is the "right thing to do" but why? Whose standards? Society? If there is no moral absolute their is no standard against which to judge right and wrong.

Besides, holding your place at the end has nothing to do with how you behave, it has to do with who you trust to hold your place.

When days come to an end is like handing in a test at the end of class. The die is cast. No second chance, you pass or fail.

If, as you believe, there is no God then all I believe is irrelevant and all I did and am will amount to nothing. If, as I believe, there is a God then many are in trouble at the end of the test.

God bless." GM


Well, I don't need someone to tell me what is "human"....I have my standards, I treat others as I would want them to treat me. I like to make people feel good, important and you know what, I think I came up with that on my own because I choose to do that everyday. I have more "faith" in myself and know that in the end, I answer to how I choose to live, and cannot blame or congratulate anyone or anything else. It was all on me.

So after I die, I will be as before I was born....

I trust myself to be the best person I can be for myself and those in my life or those I touch while I am living.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I really don't care who believes in God ... or which god they believe in ... I just wish people would stop using their faith as an excuse to beat up on everyone else who doesn't share it. In the end, none of us really "know" anything ... faith is all about what you believe. It's a personal thing, and it should stay that way.

I think Christ would be totally ashamed to associate with most of the folks I've met in my life who call themselves "Christians". And don't even get me started on the folks who sell religion on TV ... most of 'em are in it strictly for the money.

As to the power of prayer ... I suspect there's a correlation between its effectiveness and the strength of faith of the person doing the praying. Whether this is a purely self-induced response or the result of direct intervention by some higher power isn't something human beings can really explain ... at least not in any demonstrable manner.

In the end, we believe that which we are predisposed to believe, and no one can offer any real proof of the existance (or lack thereof) of any Diety ... much less the "correct" one.

That's why we call it "faith" ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Green_Manelishi]

believe as long as you are sincere"

Funny, is it not, that it suddenly does matter if I sincerely believe that those who don't believe are wrong?

My point is that sincerity is irrelevant. What you believe is relevant. Otherwise everything including one's self amounts to nothing in the grand scheme of things.
Personally, I sincerely believe it's a bee-you-tee-full and wonderful world and there must be a deeper meaning than "it's all an accident and i am born, i die, that's it".

If you sincerely believe there is no God, etc. that's your choice.

But one of us is wrong.

 

[Missdirected]

Darn and I have to run out now. These are always fun and several pages long. Lots of people doing this

Toodles.

 

[Lisa0825]

I really don't care who believes in God ... or which god they believe in ... I just wish people would stop using their faith as an excuse to beat up on everyone else who doesn't share it. In the end, none of us really "know" anything ... faith is all about what you believe. It's a personal thing, and it should stay that way.

I think Christ would be totally ashamed to associate with most of the folks I've met in my life who call themselves "Christians". And don't even get me started on the folks who sell religion on TV ... most of 'em are in it strictly for the money.

As to the power of prayer ... I suspect there's a correlation between its effectiveness and the strength of faith of the person doing the praying. Whether this is a purely self-induced response or the result of direct intervention by some higher power isn't something human beings can really explain ... at least not in any demonstrable manner.

In the end, we believe that which we are predisposed to believe, and no one can offer any real proof of the existance (or lack thereof) of any Diety ... much less the "correct" one.

That's why we call it "faith" ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

BRAVO!!!!! :wave-smil

I agree with every word!

 

[MSilvia]

Personally, I sincerely believe it's a bee-you-tee-full and wonderful world and there must be a deeper meaning than "it's all an accident and i am born, i die, that's it".

I agree with you in that, but I don't agree that the only alternative to meaningless existance is the Judeo-Christian god. I personally believe in a meaningful and ordered universe, but not in a deity per-se. If there is a creator, or "higher power", I'm not convinced that it is self-aware, and I therefore do not concern myself with its worship. I do believe that prayer can be powerful, as can any ritual or magic in which deep belief is held, but I think that that the fundamental nature of that power is psychological reenforcement. I do not believe that praying for someone who is unaware of the prayer would have any effect on the person prayed for, although it could be transformative for the person praying.

I believe that my life is a kind of energy and that it, like the matter my body is composed of, can neither be created nor destroyed but may change forms. What matters to me is making the most of this form while it lasts, not striving for reward to be received when I am in a form that may or may not exist in the future.

My beliefs, of course, are my own. I'm happy that you are likewise secure in the beliefs you hold.