Pony bottle 19 vs 30 cf, and clipped on left side of BP/W ?

[J-Vo]

I don't believe the emergency is completely over until both divers are on the surface and positively buoyant. Breathing and neutral at depth is a good thing, and is a great way to begin a controlled ascent. The issue, as I see it, OOA diver is on my gas and has no way to add air to his BC without removing the reg from his mouth and may be on the edge of panic, this is not my dive plan and the safest place for everyone is on the surface positively buoyant.

A lot has been written on the board about the incident pit and how it may be small issues that if ignored turn into a greater emergency. Believing that an emergency is over because the main casulty is stabilized, ignoring the vulnerable state you are in, to me, seems another step into the incident pit.

If I rescue someone, I want them to stay rescued.


Bob

I can't disagree. However, if we don't downgrade the situation from "Emergency" to "Urgency" we are asking for more mistakes to be made on the way up IMO.

 

[johndiver999]

I can't disagree. However, if we don't downgrade the situation from "Emergency" to "Urgency" we are asking for more mistakes to be made on the way up IMO.

What does this comment mean? How do you "downgrade the situation"? It is a situation that has been thrust upon you from an "accident" that was probably not of your cause.

Even if you are totally calm and controlled and comfortable, you have essentially zero ability to calm the victim - other than to move slowly, deliberately, show control and refrain from inducing any additional stress. That is why I am focused on simplicity in actions and communication in this situation.

Sharing air SHOULD be a trivial event; depending on the conditions and the people involved, but on the other hand, the victim may be on the verge of total panic - it is really not up to YOU.

 

[doctormike]

What does this comment mean? How do you "downgrade the situation"? It is a situation that has been thrust upon you from an "accident" that was probably not of your cause.

Even if you are totally calm and controlled and comfortable, you have essentially zero ability to calm the victim - other than to move slowly, deliberately, show control and refrain from inducing any additional stress. That is why I am focused on simplicity in actions and communication in this situation.

Sharing air SHOULD be a trivial event; depending on the conditions and the people involved, but on the other hand, the victim may be on the verge of total panic - it is really not up to YOU.

I know what the comment meant. It means that your reaction should be proportional to the urgency of the situation.

OOA diver is the highest level of emergency. That’s why the rescuer has to be able to INSTANTLY plug the victim into a gas source. If you are alone, it’s CESA or die.

Once the OOA diver has gas, you have definitely downgraded the situation. Now you have time to think, and make any appropriate adjustments to make ascent safer. Pretending that you need to head up instantly isn’t helpful.

Yeah, if you are rescuing someone who is freaking out even after they get gas that’s another problem. And it makes it even more important for the rescuer to be calm and get squared away and do a safe ascent before racing for the surface.

 

[J-Vo]

I know what the comment meant. It means that your reaction should be proportional to the urgency of the situation.

OOA diver is the highest level of emergency. That’s why the rescuer has to be able to INSTANTLY plug the victim into a gas source. If you are alone, it’s CESA or die.

Once the OOA diver has gas, you have definitely downgraded the situation. Now you have time to think, and make any appropriate adjustments to make ascent safer. Pretending that you need to head up instantly isn’t helpful.

Yeah, if you are rescuing someone who is freaking out even after they get gas that’s another problem. And it makes it even more important for the rescuer to be calm and get squared away and do a safe ascent before racing for the surface.

Thank you,

If an OOA diver can't calm down once they get gas, they better be my wife or child. Otherwise I may unplug and swim away. The first rule of rescue is to not put yourself in danger.

 

[johndiver999]

Thank you,

If an OOA diver can't calm down once they get gas, they better be my wife or child. Otherwise I
may unplug and swim away. The first rule of rescue is to not put yourself in danger.

So you would be clipping off the pony bottle to the victim in that scenario, I assume?

 

[mcpowell]

So you would be clipping off the pony bottle to the victim in that scenario, I assume?

Uhhh, I don’t think that’s what he was saying.

 

[doctormike]

See? That's another benefit of a pony bottle. You can give them some gas AND save yourself...

What are you going to do if someone bigger than you is going berserk and the only gas you can donate is on your back?

Once again, options!

 

[J-Vo]

So you would be clipping off the pony bottle to the victim in that scenario, I assume?

I'm in side mount, so no pony. I'm not gong to let them drag me toward the surface while I'm unclipping a tank. I'll cut the hose if I have to.

 

[johndiver999]

I'm in side mount, so no pony. I'm not gong to let them drag me toward the surface while I'm unclipping a tank. I'll cut the hose if I have to.

Ok that sounds like an interesting plan.

Instead of undoing 2 ???? clips that secure your side mount bottle, you are going to offer a second stage and after they use it, you are going to cut the hose off with a knife ( if they are pulling upward too hard)?

Is it easier and quicker to find and deploy a knife and cut a hose than to unclip a stage tank?

Do you ever practice cutting off second stage hoses or unclipping tanks?

I have never seen anyone dive side mount so please excuse my ignorance on this configuration.

 

[doctormike]

I think that we are getting off topic. We aren't talking about stage bottles, deco bottles or bailout bottles.

A pony bottle is mainly used by single tank backmount divers as a redundant gas supply. I'm pretty sure that's what the OP was asking about.
I guess someone in backmounted doubles might cary a pony, but since doubles already have some degree of redundancy, that would be an unusual configuration. I can't imagine a SM diver carrying an additional pony bottle for donation, and they already have completely redundant gas sources, so again, off-topic.