PADI vs NAUI

[Thezeker]

Compare RSTC standards to NAUI, CMAS, SEI, IANTD, SDI, or most others and you will see how laughable the RSTC standards are. They don't even look like standards. More like an outline of standards. Hold up in a courtroom? C'mon be serious. Get any half decent instructor up there to describe an actual class and the jury will wonder what good RSTC standards are.

I have a question. On SEI's webpage they state they teach to and exceed WRSTC standards. Here is their quote, "S.E.I. meets and exceeds WRSTC standards and is the only agency in the US to offer CMAS certifcations under USOA." Is there a difference between RSTC and WRSTC?

Also I searched high and low for a list of instructors on your (SEI) website. Is there a link I missed for that?

Thanks

 

[Jim Lapenta]

The WRSTC and the RSTC are essentially the same. All of the standards can be found on the WRSTC website.

The site is still in development. Currently all you need to do is call or email SEI HQ in Muncie and they will direct you to the nearest instructor.

 

[Brendon]

At this point in time, it does not really matter as to who certifies you.

---"No it doesn't but there are many differences between the agencies..."

They all carry the same weight in the diving world.

---"Not even close to being correct".

No one agency has any more legitimacy that any other.

---"That is a matter of opinion..."

It is a sad state of affairs, but this is the way it is. My premise from an earlier post still holds true. We need one overall certification agency that has the effect of law, and will be the only agency that can certify anyone in the U.S. as a diver.

---"What are you smoking? Would you have us elect you Chief of the scuba police as well? The effect of law would mean run by the government. Considering their track record that is the worst idea ever...I can see it now, reduced to an endorsement on you drivers license after a 15 min exam via computer at the dmv."

Many have said this will dilute the standards such as they are, this may be true initially, but the court system will force the standards to go up.

---"Are we still talking about the same country here???"

The other argument is this will reduce competition. The Ford dealer comes to mind, while there are 100's of ford dealers that al sell ford products. each one is different and each sells the product with different value added items such as a life time oil change at my dealership etc. Each sells cars at different prices, and each is unique but they are all Ford dealers.

---"Not much competition between same model car dealers... A new Ford pickup is a Ford pickup no matter where you buy it. Why should we have to give something to the consumer for free now to get them to purchase their scuba training. The shop wars have already driven down the prices about as low as they can go, including taking a loss on the course just so they can sell them gear. If all the courses are all of equal value then what? No more Chevy Silverado's, Ford f-250's Dodge 2500's. We all get to drive Isuzu Pups... "

We as the dive community should have the same thing, one agency that has the effect of law that is the only one who can certify anyone as a diver.

OK now your starting to sound like Fidel Castro... You really have not earned any opinion, that carries much weight if any in the diving community at this point. For example, I have spent more time peeing in the water while diving then you have bottom time. So before your start saying things as you have, you might think about putting a few hundred dives followed by a few more years under your belt.

 

[rigdiver]

Yea, the post office is a real stellar business model is it not? Oh, and let's not even consider what the gov has done for/to Social Security. US Federal SCUBA cert------give it a break friend.

Bill

 

[Doppler]

... We need one overall certification agency that has the effect of law, and will be the only agency that can certify anyone in the U.S. as a diver.

There are examples of this being attempted in some form or another... In France for instance.

It really does not work worth a damn.

 

[Ottoman Diver]

There is a Gov agency in turkey and it's a joke. I really wouldn't suggest it. Plus there are many other places our tax dollars should go to not to a agency that other countries won't give a damn about....

 

[-hh]

...Like I said it’s the individual instructors training that make good divers, not the organization and their conscious if they have one to see that they made a good and safe diver before they cert them.

As far as the RSTC goes, everything ...

...everything that needs to be said about them is contained within the old mantra "Its the Instructor".

Fundamentally, that deceptively simple -- and extremely common -- piece of advice is the pragmatic proof that the so-called "Industry Standards" have utterly failed to provide any degree of adequacy in quality control or descrimination between what is "good" vs "bad" training.


-hh

 

[Thalassamania]

As a first order approximation "It's the Instructor" makes sense. However, it is interesting to note that in the forty-odd years, now, that I have been involved in diving instruction and out of the, perhaps, hundreds of instructors that I've worked with directly, every one of those that I'd put on my "best of the best" list was a NAUI Instructor. That's not to say that there are not good instructors to be found in all agencies, perhaps (in fact probably) there are, but if I had to play the odds, based on my experiences, with nothing to go on but the agency on the card, there's no question in my mind.

 

[Blackwood]

As a first order approximation "It's the Instructor" makes sense. However, it is interesting to note that in the forty-odd years, now, that I have been involved in diving instruction and out of the, perhaps, hundreds of instructors that I've worked with directly, every one of those that I'd put on my "best of the best" list was a NAUI Instructor. That's not to say that there are not good instructors to be found in all agencies, perhaps (in fact probably) there are, but if I had to play the odds, based on my experiences, with nothing to go on but the agency on the card, there's no question in my mind.

Out if curiosity, how many (if any) of those BotB were also instructors for other agencies (i.e. in addition to NAUI)?

 

[Thalassamania]

Of my "top ten," four had been certified in the past by PADI either as part of the original invitees or as part of a multi-cert program (common in the old days, I was eligible to be certified as a NAUI, YMCA and PADI instructor at a single ITC, I never sent in the dues to join YMCA or PADI), but none were actively certifying anything but NAUI. One other had been a PADI Instructor originally (back when there was no restriction on what or how you taught) but quit and did a NAUI crossover with me when PADI attempted to force the USMA (West Point) program into the PADI mold and took away his ability to run PADI ITCs for his staff. I'd bet that if you expanded that on to my "top fifty," you'd pick up a lot of younger folks who were not part of the multi-agency old days and thus held only NAUI cards.

Most all of us also held a bunch of certifications that were basically given on an "honorary" (but usable, I guess it was considered "reciprocal") basis with groups like CMAS, TDI, IANTD, etc.