P-valve hose routing vs infections?

[Nicool]

Hi folks,
I've read several threads abiut p-valve routing discussions (up or down) and the discussion is usually a matter of whether you're ok to have a hole in your undergarnments or not.

I've been using downwards routing for 5 years with:
-1 drysuit, 2 successive p-valves
-1 thick wetsuit (almost semi dry) 1 p-valve
Have been very happy with these.
I confess that i have never cleaned any of these p-valves, due to laziness and fear to damage the suit with cleaning solution (white vinegar) if not properly rinced.
Alwas used with a quick disconnect system.
No infection/no issue whatsoever for 200-250 dives.
Note that i have the habit to test the plumbing (aka pee in the valve) on the surface each time i don the suit, so with gravity helping, i presume "fresh pee" cleans/pushes out whatever was left from previous dive.

Now in my new drysuit the p-valve hole has been installed too high and it makes downwards routing difficult, so i am considering upwards routing.

My concern: when plumbing in the quick disconnect with the norprene pipe going up and down to my thing, i am concerned i will have old pee or dirt falling inside the catheter onto my thing (simple gravity again).

What do you think? Am i being over-concerned?

Cheers
Nicolas

 

[DA Aquamaster]

You're being over concerned in the wrong areas.

First, A solution of 50% white vinegar and 50% 91% rubbing alcohol won't ruin your suit, but rinsing your pee valve with it after every dive day will kill what's in there before it can get established. Alcohol has a Ph of 5.5 so it's mildly acidic and won't overly dilute the white vinegar (Ph 2.5).

Second, once the line is full, the things you are worried about will swim and or float all through the tube, and with level trim, gravity wont matter as up or down it's all horizontal. What matters is that the system not be obstructed. If you have a kink in the hose or the end of the condom catheter - that's where things become a problem. Once you have positive pressure in the system from bladder to valve, you run a major risk of germs getting all the way upstream and causing a UTI or kidney infection.

I say this from the perspective of getting the mother of all kidney infections after a dive involving some scraping through aa low, silty, seldom traveled cave passage (with the valve getting in the silt) AND having the condom cath come partly off and try to glue itself shut, creating an obstruction that made it very difficult to get it all over board. .

I've been religious about both flushing the valve every day and proper hose routing since then, and it's been about 7 years now with no issues, even with frequent dives in very snug and silty sidemount passages. I route up, mostly because it is a better option to prevent any hose or catheter kinks. YMMV.

I also do not use norprene tubing. as it is black and you can't see what's in it. Instead I use clear 3/16" tubing that slides inside the catheter with a friction fit and is secured with a pair of #10 O-rings over the catheter. I use a 6" piece of tubing on the catheter and then a double barb connector to the rest of the tubing in the suit. Based on what I can see in clear tubing, even with a daily flush with alcohol and white vinegar, I suspect divers with norprene tubing do not change their tubing nearly often enough.

 

[fmerkel]

I also do not use norprene tubing. as it is black and you can't see what's in it. Instead I use clear 3/16" tubing that slides inside the catheter with a friction fit and is secured with a pair of #10 O-rings over the catheter. I use a 6" piece of tubing on the catheter and then a double barb connector to the rest of the tubing in the suit. Based on what I can see in clear tubing, even with a daily flush with alcohol and white vinegar, I suspect divers with norprene tubing do not change their tubing nearly often enough.

Never gotten an infection. Use warm water rinses immediately after diving and again at home. Occasionally flush with vinegar and once in awhile completely disassemble and clean thoroughly.
Have always used the default neoprene tubing but I think I'll look into that clear tubing.
The neoprene is very kink resistant, but it's not very flexible so routing includes large round curves, up for me. I assume the clear is less kink resistant?

 

[Jack Hammer]

I just keep a bottle with Steramine in my gear and flush right after the dive. Used to use ear beer. Both work fine

 

[guruboy]

just rinse your tube after you're done diving, man.

 

[Kevrumbo]

Rinse it out daily after use with a lot of running water preferably with a garden hose/nozzle attachment, or at least several water irrigation flushes with a 60cc medical syringe if in the field or at sea:

Valve Flusher for Power inflators and Dry Suit Inflators
Irrigation Syringe, 70cc, 60cc, 70ml, 38470, 38470,

The most important step afterward is to dry it all out thoroughly -including the entire length of the tubing- carefully using an air nozzle LP hose attachment (AA02 or A303):

TRIDENT's 2018 Catalog

 

[Nicool]

Hi all
Thanks a lot guys for your replies.

DA Aquamaster,
Good point, once dive is started hose routings are equal gravity wise, and the trigger for infections seems rather to be hose kinks (which also is confirmed by my previous readings).
On that end i believe my straight routing is pretty robust: short solid hose (norprene, but i had a good clear tubing before, had to change due to pee valve change), and most importantly, i shorten the tip of my catheters (rochester widebands) so that the quick disconnect male part is partly within the "dome" section of the catheter. This way, whichever the direction my guy moves, the catheter cannot collapse to a point where urin won't moved out. I've trief in all direction, and it had happened to me before i started such trimming.

Fmerkel,
See my above comment regarding catheter trimming, as the best way to avoid kinks i think (provided your hose is rigid enough).

Keveumbo,
Thanks for pointing at the tools, these are useful to have i'll get some.

Cheers
Nicolas

 

[sava6e]

I rinse with water and then hibiclense, let it sit and then flush and let dry, day of dive first thing I do once I arrive is flush with more hibiclense while I set up my gear.