OUPV Limitations

[divezonescuba]

How about this?

If I run a OUPV with six paying divers, can I have a seventh or even eighth person, say divemasters/instructors who have agreeded to function as divemasters/guides.

In this case, the divemasters/guides are considered unpaid crew and are entitled to the tips from the six paying divers as a result of functioning as the divemasters/guides?

 

[gene1340]

Yes, that is correct. As long as you only have 6 paying customers on board you are fine. Obviously if your boat is only certified for less people than that would also limit you, but the answer is 6 paying customers and however many crew is acceptable.
Gene

 

[SkipperJohn]

isn't that for what we call a 6-pack?
I dont believe my license is mimited as to the number of paying customers.

 

[captndale]

I have spent some time reviewing the appropriate CFR's and this is my interpretation.

If at least one person pays for passage the trip is a charter.

If the trip is a charter, then everyone on the vessel is classified as either a passenger or crew.

Crew are paid.

Uninspected vessels are limited to six passengers.

Crew members who have any responsibility for the safety of the passengers, crew or vessel must be enrolled in a random drug testing program.

Therefore, that seventh person must be a paid crewmwmber who either is part of your drug program or has duties that do not relate in any way to safety.

 

[SkipperJohn]

I have spent some time reviewing the appropriate CFR's and this is my interpretation.

If at least one person pays for passage the trip is a charter.

If the trip is a charter, then everyone on the vessel is classified as either a passenger or crew.

Crew are paid.

Uninspected vessels are limited to six passengers.

Crew members who have any responsibility for the safety of the passengers, crew or vessel must be enrolled in a random drug testing program.

Therefore, that seventh person must be a paid crewmwmber who either is part of your drug program or has duties that do not relate in any way to safety.

That's interesting. In 4 or 5 renewals I never have been enrolled in any random drug testing program. I simply got a certified drug test just prior to my renewals.

 

[rjack321]

That's interesting. In 4 or 5 renewals I never have been enrolled in any random drug testing program. I simply got a certified drug test just prior to my renewals.

If you are actually working under your license's authority you must be in a random drug testing program.

If you are not actually responsible for passengers for hire (like me), then you don't need to be enrolled in a drug testing program.

To renew you need to provide documentation that you are in a random drug testing program or provide evidence of a test within the past 6 months.

 

[Capt Gary]

I had this very issue come up and asked my MSO in the USCG for the answer. He said that as long as your crew is teaching they are not considered a paying customer and are not counted in the 6. So if you have 6 paying customers and another 3 instructors on the boat teaching a OUPV Captain can run this.

As for the drug testing program. You must be a member of a drug consortium that meets the CFR requirements for random drug testing.

All good questions Captains.

Good Diving,

 

[Tortuga James]

From my understanding, one of the reasons for the enrollment for crew members was to discourage the Captain from squeezing additional passengers on as "crew". Making sure that person is enrolled in your program is meant to be a deterrent for bending the 6 pack rules. In my case, I offer 5/6th's pricing to shops and group leaders/instuctors so they can dive for free if they charter the boat (I try not to sell seats).

If the enrollment rule was not in effect, I could let that person ride (and dive) for free and get 100% of my charter fee with six "paying" passengers.

I recently set up a vessel program with Marine Consortium and inquired whether I could use part time crew enrolled in another vessel's program and the answer was that crew serving on my vessel must be enrolled in my program. I think that is crazy, it virtually eliminates the free lance crew member.

 

[rjack321]

From my understanding, one of the reasons for the enrollment for crew members was to discourage the Captain from squeezing additional passengers on as "crew". Making sure that person is enrolled in your program is meant to be a deterrent for bending the 6 pack rules. In my case, I offer 5/6th's pricing to shops and group leaders/instuctors so they can dive for free if they charter the boat (I try not to sell seats).

If the enrollment rule was not in effect, I could let that person ride (and dive) for free and get 100% of my charter fee with six "paying" passengers.

I recently set up a vessel program with Marine Consortium and inquired whether I could use part time crew enrolled in another vessel's program and the answer was that crew serving on my vessel must be enrolled in my program. I think that is crazy, it virtually eliminates the free lance crew member.

I had this very issue come up and asked my MSO in the USCG for the answer. He said that as long as your crew is teaching they are not considered a paying customer and are not counted in the 6. So if you have 6 paying customers and another 3 instructors on the boat teaching a OUPV Captain can run this.

As for the drug testing program. You must be a member of a drug consortium that meets the CFR requirements for random drug testing.

All good questions Captains.

Good Diving,

I have Gary's understanding of this. You can have "paying passengers", non-paying passengers, and crew aboard. The instructors in this case are not crew and need not be enrolled in a drug testing program. They are instead non-paying passengers and don't count as far as your license limits go. So six paying, 3 non-paying, and 2 crew (11 bodies) could be legally carried on a 6 pack boat. The CG is only counting the paying bodies not the free-loaders

 

[gene1340]

Skipper John,
Your signature line shows "master", which means oupv rules don't apply to you. My 50 ton masters is the same. Unless I am mistaken all oupv license are six pack only.
Gene