Not understanding the long hose thing

[WetDawg]

All this back and forth and no one (even Instructors) have mentioned another of the most obvious benefits of the long hose; it makes you more streamlined.

Contrary to the silliness posted by those who have clearly NEVER used a long hose, one of real neat advantages is that is REMOVES the hazard of having 6 to 8 inches of primary hose loop sticking out over your right shoulder while you swim. With the LH you have nothing protruding outside of your shoulders and therefore are more streamlined and SAFER! Wow, how much would you pay now? But wait there's more...

The only "hazardous loop" is safely tucked away flat against your body where it is much LESS likely to get snagged.

Come on guys, open your minds. Actually try something a few times before you resort to the "old school" bashing of other ideas.

I say if it works for you, dive it. If not, dive something else.

Oh, BTW,, I use my can light on open water dives every Wednesday night. Again, once you have tried it, you will never go back to any other kind of light. Having too much light underwater, cave or otherwise, is like having too much money, a very rare problem. Come join us and see for yourself...everyone leaves wanting a cool light too!

 

[Adobo]

Well, you may be right , but in the promotion, they came with a free octo and that must be because the vast, vast majority of the SCUBA world and almost all instructors and dive instruction agencies teach----breath the primary on a short hose and donate the octopus (seconday) on a somewhat longer hose.

Even if the sets are not sold together outside of a promotion, dive shop or manufacturer, it is obvious the manufacturer intended such usage as the reason they make those cute yellow matching second stages. :cool2: Oh, and most rental units are rigged this way as well, it is pretty universal outside of Scubaboard.

Will this thread become longer than the "Secret DIR" or the "Blue Sparkle Plate vs BC", that is the question? These hose vs hose and BP vs BC threads get serious don't they, especially when they involve secret equipment we mere neophytes cannot conceptualize.

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Scubapro has been pushing the Air 2 solution for years. In this configuration, the diver has no choice but to donate his primary reg. When I took my open water course, that is the configuration I was encouraged to adopt. I suspect that scubapro doesn't favor any approach above another for as long as it is scubapro equipment that is purchased.

Maybe I am cycnical but I do not gleen anything from manufacturers' configurations and diveshop displays other than how they can more effectively sell gear. Even with instructors affiliated with dive shops, they use what they use not because it is what they think is optimal but rather it is what their dive shop tells them to use. At least, that is the case in my area.

I will agree with you though that something like a 7' hose is not a trivial piece of equipment to employ in traditional open water recreational diving. If nothing else, there is the stowing of the hose to be considered. And unless you have a can light and a backplate (which I suspect are incredibly rare with vacation divers), you might be left having to figure out for yourself a system for deploying and restowing the hose.

 

[sschlesi]

The second is, it makes filling up a SMB or lift bag real easy. You, as the diver, can give yourself plenty of distance between your lift bag and the object your lifting, which really allows you to get a great visual on the situation.

How does that work? It seems to me that in order to press the purge valve your reg must be in your hand no matter the length of the hose?

 

[UCFKnightDiver]

Scubapro has been pushing the Air 2 solution for years. In this configuration, the diver has no choice but to donate his primary reg. When I took my open water course, that is the configuration I was encouraged to adopt. I suspect that scubapro doesn't favor any approach above another for as long as it is scubapro equipment that is purchased.

Maybe I am cycnical but I do not gleen anything from manufacturers' configurations and diveshop displays other than how they can more effectively sell gear. Even with instructors affiliated with dive shops, they use what they use not because it is what they think is optimal but rather it is what their dive shop tells them to use. At least, that is the case in my area.

I will agree with you though that something like a 7' hose is not a trivial piece of equipment to employ in traditional open water recreational diving. If nothing else, there is the stowing of the hose to be considered. And unless you have a can light and a backplate (which I suspect are incredibly rare with vacation divers), you might be left having to figure out for yourself a system for deploying and restowing the hose.

It's real simple as already stated; Use a knife sheath, shears sheath, or tuck the long hose into the waiste band. Oh and a backplate has nothing to do with stowing.

Also in my opinion, the air 2 and any other octo/inflator made by other manufacturers is the most retarted and ill conceived setup ever concocted.

 

[Gombessa]

It's real simple as already stated; Use a knife sheath, shears sheath, or tuck the long hose into the waiste band. Oh and a backplate has notthing to do with stowing.

I think what Adobo is getting at is that not many jacket BCs even have a "waist band" to thread a sheath or pocket through.

 

[UCFKnightDiver]

I think what Adobo is getting at is that not many jacket BCs even have a "waist band" to thread a sheath or pocket through.

I understand that, tucking it in the waiste band works just fine too. Awhile back before I had a single bp/w setup, I used to use a Mares Dragon BCD which did not allow me thread anything onto the waiste band. I still used a long hose but just tucked it into the waiste band, it never came out etc, and worked just fine.

 

[Gombessa]

Originally Posted by Gombessa
I think what Adobo is getting at is that not many jacket BCs even have a "waist band" to thread a sheath or pocket through.

I understand that, tucking it in the waiste band works just fine too.

There's a certain humor present if you go back and read the last few responses.

 

[UCFKnightDiver]

There's a certain humor present if you go back and read the last few responses.

Ahh, I suppose I should have said cumberbund to avoid confusion

 

[boulderjohn]

I dived conventional setup for years, the last few being with a ScubaPro Nighthawk BCD. I used to read all this back and forth on SB, and I was especially turned off by a couple of people (no longer active AFAIK) whose periodic outbursts proclaimed that OW divers with conventional rigs were going to die as a result. What a crock!

I then started doing tech diving with doubles with the Hog gear and got used to using the long hose and bungeed secondary. Because tech diving takes all the available $$$ a near pauper like me has available, I made no changes to my old rig for use in normal OW conditions. I did not want to buy a singles wing, Single Tank Adapter, and new regulator setup when my old gear worked just fine.

I later got a new complete set of doubles regs, leaving me with some extra hoses from the old ones. At about the same time, I read a story on SB about someone who drowned when she went OOA and could not find her buddy's octo because it had come unclipped and stuck somewhere behind him. I gave it a lot of thought, and switched out the hoses on my singles gear, mostly because I like the bungeed alternate.

I went with the long hose (7') as well. My Nighthawk has weight pockets with a clip system on the outside. The extra hose length tucks in nicely under that clip system.

Having that system now, I have given a lot of thought to the points in this thread. I believe the main reason we are taught to hold tightly to one another in a conventional OOA situation is not because of panic but because with the short hose there is no "give;" if the donating diver jerks even a little during the ascent, it could pull the regulator out of the other diver's mouth. In contrast, the long hose has a lot of play in it, so it can absorb such movements without affecting the other diver so much. The receiving diver can swim comfortably while holding on to the hose to control it. Given a minute or so to regain control, any initial panic should be gone when the true ascent begins. Assuming at least one of you had proper control of the air supply, there should be no reason for a rapid and panicked ascent.

No, you aren't going to die because you are using a conventional setup in the open water. If needed, the system should work just fine for its intended purpose. But I do like the long hose setup better.

 

[Adobo]

I understand that, tucking it in the waiste band works just fine too. Awhile back before I had a single bp/w setup, I used to use a Mares Dragon BCD which did not allow me thread anything onto the waiste band. I still used a long hose but just tucked it into the waiste band, it never came out etc, and worked just fine.

I found using a knife sheath to be only mediocre in keeping the hose in place. A can light works much better. Neither is an option for this purpose unless you have a backplate.

Some people will be able to easily deploy and stow the hose in a cumberband. Some won't. Regardless, employing a 7' hose is not as simple as going to the dive shop and pulling your your credit card. Among other things, one needs to:
- consider how to stow the length of the hose such that the hose itself is not a hazard.
- One also needs to think about the backup reg solution. It doesn't make sense having a long primary hose and a octo clipped to your side.
- one needs to know the correct process such that the primary hose is not trapping the backup reg. (Incidentally, I saw a pic of a fellow scubaboard member proudly displaying his new "DIR" compliant set up. Aside from having his primary and backup regs tangled in knot against each other, he looked good.)

The nice thing about any standard approach taught by most agencies (such as GUE) is that you have some resources you can draw upon to find out the best practices. Once you start deviating from the pieces prescribed in those approaches, you essentially have to rediscover the wheel for yourself.

Your familiarity with the proper use of a long hose does not make it easy-peasy lemon-squeezy for the average recreational diver.