nitrox downsides

[bardass]

I know a lady who will not dive on Nitrox because she swears it makes her feel ill, which I thought odd as I too feel much better and less fatigued using it, but I guess everyone is a little different....

I know a lady diver who can no longer use nitrox.
Yet her physical condition and age, 68, mean that she should be using nitrox.
nitrox irritates her lungs; she coughs when she gets out of the water and feels a burning sensation for hours.
when she uses air, she doesn't cough and her lungs aren't irritated.

 

[dlofting]

I know a lady diver who can no longer use nitrox.
Yet her physical condition and age, 68, mean that she should be using nitrox.
nitrox irritates her lungs; she coughs when she gets out of the water and feels a burning sensation for hours.
when she uses air, she doesn't cough and her lungs aren't irritated.

Now that's interesting. Any idea why this happens?

 

[RIHappyDiver]

@poko21 , sorry you have to go through this, but this is basic thread progression on ScubaBoard.

So, yes, as long as you stick within the rules that you were taught in your class, there is no real downside. There may be dives that you want to do where air is a better choice, but seldom. Also, there may be a point where you go into tech diving and that will be a whole different ball of wax.

For now, dive all the nitrox you want, and enjoy yourself!

Erik

 

[Scuba-guy]

tips are a gratuity and not mandatory, In Japan tipping is seen as an insult. No requirement to tip anywhere really. In places like Philippines I wont tip cash but buy a lechon pig so all the staff & boat crew and guides get a good feed in.

You're suggesting, in the BASIC SCUBA sub forum, which is viewed and posted to by BEGINNER divers, that narcosis is a good thing and should be embraced.. because it feels good?

Seems irresponsible.

And paying for nitrox and not giving the DM who is responsible for your safety the money instead is responsible? How many selfish divers paid for nitrox and didn't tip the DM anything? The answer is most of them. The DM gets paid half of what a tank of nitrox cost per diver. 6 divers for one DM only $14 per dive. By me they charge $6.66 extra for a nitrox tank but only pay less than $2.50 to the DM for each diver per dive. Anyone who pays for nitrox should also pay the DM at least as much as they paid for the nitrox, or better yet skip the nitrox and just pay the DM, you'll get more bang for your buck.

 

[poko21]

@poko21 , sorry you have to go through this, but this is basic thread progression on ScubaBoard.

So, yes, as long as you stick within the rules that you were taught in your class, there is no real downside. There may be dives that you want to do where air is a better choice, but seldom. Also, there may be a point where you go into tech diving and that will be a whole different ball of wax.

For now, dive all the nitrox you want, and enjoy yourself!

Erik

perfect thank you!

 

[crofrog]

You're suggesting that millions of recreational divers are doing themselves some sort of grave disservice because they don't use trimix when diving within recreational limits?

I mean define grave, they're increasing their risks factors. Gas density increases CO2 retention. It causes the diver to exert higher negative pressures to inhale increases the risk of IPE, and increases the risk of dyspnea. IPE is probably one of the single biggest risk factors facing scuba divers, and IPEs are believed to be significantly more common than previously reported. (Divers Alert Network, n.d.)

Let's think about what elevated pCO2 does.

• CO2 is a vasodilator
  • This increases your risk of DCS probably because of vasodilation during the on-gassing phase of the dive. (Daubresse et al., 2024).
  • It increases your risk of CNS O2 toxicity
• CO2 is has 20x more narcotic potency than N2. (Clark, J.E., 2015)
• CO2 increases anxiety and reduces executive function (Savulich et al, 2019)

This makes it easy for gas density to start to create a positive feedback loop, where gas density causes the diver to have a harder time breathing, which increases breathing rate, which decreases gas exchange, which increases CO2 retention, which increases anxiety and narcosis, which in turn increases breathing rate, so on and so forth.

It's interesting how different people believe things that have no merit or basis in fact.

Agreed.




Divers Alert Network. (n.d.). What is the common risk faced by recreation, technical and breath-hold divers?https://dan.org/safety-prevention/d...-recreation-technical-and-breath-hold-divers/

Daubresse, L., Vallée, N., Druelle, A., Castagna, O., Guieu, R., & Blatteau, J. E. (2024). Effects of CO₂ on the occurrence of decompression sickness: review of the literature. Diving and hyperbaric medicine, 54(2), 110–119. Diving and Hyperbaric Medicine - Abstracts 2024 54 (2)

Clark, J.E. Moving in extreme environments: inert gas narcosis and underwater activities.
Extrem Physiol Med 4, 1 (2015). Moving in extreme environments: inert gas narcosis and underwater activities - Extreme Physiology & Medicine

Savulich, G., Hezemans, F.H., van Ghesel Grothe, S. et al. Acute anxiety and autonomic arousal induced by CO2 inhalation impairs prefrontal executive functions in healthy humans. Transl Psychiatry 9, 296 (2019). Acute anxiety and autonomic arousal induced by CO2 inhalation impairs prefrontal executive functions in healthy humans - Translational Psychiatry

 

[jborg]

There's a spectrum at play here, as well. Do we need trimix to take a short dip down to 33m under calm tropical circumstances as part of an otherwise slightly shallower dive? I think most would agree, no. Would I plan a cold water wreck dive to 40m on air? Also no. I suspect most of the "bah, trimix shlimix" people are talking more about the first kind of recreational dive than the latter?

 

[bardass]

Overly active imagination, vulnerability and naivity possibly combined with a strong belief in conspiracy theories.

Another possibility is that this particular lady doesn't fully understand the complexities and proper usage of nitrox and experiences a moderate degree anxiety when she knows she'll be diving with it. To ease her anxiety prior to the dive she smokes a few cigarettes before splashing...

You're talking **** ...
You don't know this diver, yet you're imagining what she might be like, what she might believe...

I am a nitrox and trimix instructor in France, Oc and CCR.
My colleagues and I encourage all divers to use nitrox and trimix as much as possible.

We trained this lady in nitrox diving given her age and physical condition. She is enthusiastic and request about nitrox when the shops couldn't supply it.

Several months after her training, we noticed her hoarse cough when she came up from her dives.
She also told us about a burning sensation in her lungs and dry mucous membranes.
These are known effects of oxygen therapy.
But I had never encountered such cases with the use of nitrox in diving.
It is a fact that some divers are much more sensitive than others to oxygen inhalation.
Unfortunately, this diver now dives much less than before (she has gone from 30-40 dives to less than 15 dives per year) because she still wants to dive with nitrox and not use air.

Nitrox has enormous advantages in terms of decompression and safety.
Even if the reduction in fatigue is a placebo effect, it doesn't matter as long as the diver feels good.

But it also has disadvantages depending on the sensitivity of the divers.
There is no point in hiding this and mocking those who suffer the consequences.

 

[crofrog]

Several months after her training, we noticed her hoarse cough when she came up from her dives.
She also told us about a burning sensation in her lungs and dry mucous membranes.
These are known effects of oxygen therapy.

Is she a smoker?

 

[jborg]

It is a fact that some divers are much more sensitive than others to oxygen inhalation.

If this is indeed a fact, it must be rare enough that most divers will not have heard of it -- or have cause to hear about it...