New student "gear packages"

[scjoe]

I believe that the general consensus in the industry is that the drop out rate within 2-3 years is about 70%, although no one has precise stats. The Undercurrent article mentioned provides a good analysis.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

That is exactly my point. You can't just look at "your circle". In the world of statistics this is called selection bias. If you only look your crowd of active divers, then of course you see a group of active divers, but that is not the norm. Ask a couple dive shops in your area what pays the rent and keeps the lights on. I would be willing to bet that it isn't from people who replace their basic open water packages. I am not saying that they don't make money from selling to active divers, clearly they do, what I am questioning is your assertion

I have put out there how I think the economics works. Why don't you do the same? What fraction of new divers do you think are still active within a couple years? What fraction of those go on to replace their gear, and how do you think that forms the basis of the LDS business model?

I think it depends on where you live and dive.

I am pretty conversant with the local shops. I know most of the owners, have worked at three different shops as either a DM or instructor, and am very much involved with another local shop at the moment ... enough so to observe trends in our area.

When I tell you that some shops make most of their money from "regulars", I'm not guessing ... I know that they do. I can tell you which shops cater to repeat customers, and which cater to casual divers ... and we have both types in abundance.

Locals here tend to dive a lot ... they dive year round ... and since the water's cold, they tend to own a lot of gear. Conditions here tend to produce avid divers, and so the drop-out rate isn't anywhere near what it would be in places where diving isn't readily available ... and probably not what it would be in tourist destinations that cater to vacation divers. And of the drop-outs here, a significant percentage are people who go whole-hog into diving for 4 or 5 years, then changes in their lifestyle (families, etc) cause them to give it up and move on to other things. Those people tend to collect several thousands dollars worth of gear in the process ... I know this, because they often come to me and ask me to help them sell it.

A few months ago I reorganized my office, and as an exercise I went through the student folders I've accumulated since 2004 ... and about 70% of the divers listed in those folders I can verify as still diving. Of the remaining, most are people I've lost track of so I don't know whether they are or not.

I think that like a lot of these discussions, it really depends on region ... and nobody keeps close enough tabs on the industry as a whole to really project trends.

For that reason, rather than speculate on the industry as a whole, I try to speak to that which I can observe and verify ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[TSandM]

I went through the student folders I've accumulated since 2004 ... and about 70% of the divers listed in those folders I can verify as still diving.

Something to be proud of, Bob.

Every time I say something about not being worth anything to my LDS, because I don't buy much, my husband reminds me about the two dry suits and the deco tanks and . . . I buy more gear than I think I do

 

[Dyno Bill]

I believe that the general consensus in the industry is that the drop out rate within 2-3 years is about 70%, although no one has precise stats. The Undercurrent article mentioned provides a good analysis.

Thats about what I remember from a number of years back as to divers still diving. Care and maintenance and care of golf clubs just is a ton easier along with all the prep work to go diving. It's just not as used friendly.
Bill

 

[Lenaxia]

As a recently certified diver, I made sure to do my own research. It sounds like OP and probably many other people ended up buying stuff from their LDS out of almost a sense of loyalty. I have yet to see anyone mention that it's also the consumer's responsibility to investigate future possibilities and other options.

I'm still waiting for my first BC arrive next Monday (yay Brigade), but even for my first BC, I already started considering going straight to a BP/W. Why? Because I had asked what other options there are besides jackets... and I read scubaboard

It is very much your own onus to know what you're purchasing, even if you're new to the sport. I purchased a 7mm suit with the full knowledge that I will upgrade to dry very quickly after, but it is something I feel would be nice to have anyway as a backup or just laying around incase I need it, even after I go dry (plus I like being in the water, not separated from it).



I do have a question though, which I have noticed as I read through this thread that I have never seen addressed anywhere else...

It seems most people feel that drysuits are a pretty trivial thing and can be addressed in a single pool session. Is the class worthwhile? Or would having an experienced dry diver giving a crash course in suit operation be sufficient?

 

[scubadude333]

I got certified at Rick's pro dive a few months ago and had exactly the opposite problem; they were trying to sell me some good gear at a ridiculous price...I advise all new students to browse the internet for a day and get in mind some of the prices...then cut them almost in half and see how much you would have to pay. Then you can buy a slightly used set from someone who got certified then never dives. I am in the process of paying 1000 for a seaquest balance bcd, akona full wetsuit, hood, and gloves, titan aqualung reg and octo, suunto dive computer, blade fins mask snorkel, booties, dive light (nemo 4c) and dive bag which is twice as much as the dive shop was trying to sell me for 1500 which just included the bc and reg. I have force fins which are ten times as good as split or blade fins...hope i helped

 

[DaleC]

I do have a question though, which I have noticed as I read through this thread that I have never seen addressed anywhere else...

It seems most people feel that drysuits are a pretty trivial thing and can be addressed in a single pool session. Is the class worthwhile? Or would having an experienced dry diver giving a crash course in suit operation be sufficient?

Depends,

If you have a mentor who can impart information well a course probably is not required.
If you don't, there are some issues with a DS that can cause issues. Some can be dangerous (uncontrolled bouyant ascents) and some can be bothersome (sizing and trim issues).

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I have force fins which are ten times as good as split or blade fins...

hope i helped

... immensely ... thank you ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)