My Head is Spinning! Need Help Picking A Regulator!!!

[Eric Sedletzky]

What is "a fortune"? ScubaPro MK25/A600 or MK25/A700 - is that too much to spend for rec diving?

The MK25/A700 is over $700. If that's not a rip off then I don't know what is.
And that's not including an octo reg for probably another $300 to $400 for SP plus then you need a pressure guage ($70). And don't forget the hoses, that will be another $80 for a HP and an octo hose.

If you want a metal faced reg find an old SP MK5/109, Or go with Jim Lapenta's deal, no way you can beat that for something new.

 

[LowDrag]

For the amount of use that most recreational divers give their regulators, annual rebuilds are unnecessary, as long as the reg receives decent care in use and storage. This policy is simply a way of getting customers in the shop on an annual basis, and I suppose, guarding against liability.

I couldn't recommend for or against you personally servicing your own regs. For me it was an easy decision to make; I'm mechanically inclined and the local tech at the time was expensive and only marginally qualified. But your situation might be entirely different.

Sounds good. I can see the gimmick to get you in the store and I can understand it. They have to get you in there somehow, for me it is how I am treated after I go in that makes or breaks the shop and the deal being made. I hate dirty sales people. I will buy a product if it is a quality product and it is worth the money but lie to me and I am history.

The guideline is really a matter of preference and what you are willing to pay for performance. There's no doubt that a top end reg will breathe more effortlessly (well, when it's been serviced well) than an entry level reg, but the difference is usually quite subtle from the perspective of a new diver. Forget about the "my life depends...." nonsense. There is ZERO safety difference between high end and entry level regs, and your life depends on your dive behavior, judgement, and training. NOT your choice in regulator. Until you realize that, you are likely to have a fairly high degree of anxiety about your reg, and that's just what unscrupulous dealers want you to have.

Fear and sex are two of the most effective sales devices known.

Fair enough, consider the "my life depends...." nonsense" out the window. All other stuff aside then, how does a new guy like me know if someone is doing a crap job of servicing my reg's? What should I look for that would be a tell tale sign if there is such a thing that is noticeable to the novice eye?

 

[flots am]

Breathing water does NOT support life. Therefore a regulator underwater DOES function as "life support."

It's only "life support" if you die when it fails. Nobody drowns when a reg fails unless they were poorly trained or forgot their training.

The term "life support" is tossed about very loosely by the SCUBA industry in an effort to sell equipment through fear.

That isn't to say that I'm recommending bad equipment. I own a small pile of regulators ranging from $900 down to $50 on eBay. All work very well, but none is "life support" on an OW dive.

If a diver dies on an OW dive because of an equipment failure, 100% of the blame goes to lack of training and/or skills.

flots.

 

[flots am]

As for any scams, I am definitely new to this arena and need to be careful about avoiding misinformation. In regards to unecessary service, I have to question that statement. Are you refferring to something other than normal annual service or whatever service interval the manufacturer recommends? I was reading a thread earlier about servicing your own reg's.

Service intervals are really difficult to nail down.

The manufacturer's specified service interval is driven partly by liability concerns (your safety) and partly by profit. Depending on usage, care and storage, as well as regulator design, some regulators can go significantly past their recommended service interval, while others should have been serviced at half that interval or less. Rental regs can need service in way less than 6 months, depending on use and care. Following the manufacturer's guidelines might waste money or save you trouble, and it's really hard to tell over the internet which it would be. If you're new, I'd recommend follwoing the manufacturer's guidelines at least until you have a solid understanding of why you might (or might not) want to.

I am not necessarily buying into any BS but I do consider a reg setup to be a piece of equipment that supports me under water.

Your regulator is important, but has little to do with keeping you alive. That's what your brain and training is for. In fact, back at the dawn of time, SCUBA divers were taught to breathe directly off a tank, with no regulator (as a skill, not a regular practice), and "running out of air" was a regularly used method of ending a dive. I'm not recommending any of this, but the "life support" aspect is pounded hard as a way to sell equipment.

The funny part is that I'm all about high quality equipment, I just don't beleive any of it is life support on an OW dive.

On an overhead dive, it might be, but only if you manage to have multiple failures at the same time you manage to lose your buddy, during the wrong part of the dive.

The thing that will give you the biggest margin of safety during a dive is good training, clear thinking and good judgement.

flots.

 

[Slater]

Awesome info guys, stoked that this thread turned out to be so informative!
Voldemort Scuba tried to sell me the SP mk25/600 today coincidentally...
Not going there but going to research this to death & try to make an educated choice.
Would hate to make a purchase & be dissapointed or wish I would have went another direction.
Any non-baised / multiple reviews out there on the HOG's?

 

[halocline]

All other stuff aside then, how does a new guy like me know if someone is doing a crap job of servicing my reg's? What should I look for that would be a tell tale sign if there is such a thing that is noticeable to the novice eye?

Unfortunately, this is not always so easy, at least in the beginning. Of course, if you bring a perfectly functioning reg in for annual service and it comes back breathing worse or freeflowing, that's a strong indication that your tech is not doing a good job. Sometimes the reg will have a problem shortly after service, or you might notice some scratches that weren't there, stuff like that. It's not that different than trying to evaluate an auto mechanic; unfortunately apart from the obvious stuff you almost have to wait until you have a problem to know the guy screwed up.

If you want to get into it a little deeper, check out the sticky on regulator inspection. You can buy an IP gauge for about $20, and if you have that, a tank, and a sink, you can tell a lot about how a regulator is doing. Next step might be to buy Vance Harlow's book on regulator repair so you'll have a good idea of how they work and what some of the facts vs myths are.

 

[flots am]

Awesome info guys, stoked that this thread turned out to be so informative!
Voldemort Scuba tried to sell me the SP mk25/600 today coincidentally...

I'm partial to the Atomic Aquatics, which are made by a company started by ex-SCUBAPro employees, and are made the way SCUBAPro used to be made (with metal valve parts inside).

OTOH, if you're not in a huge hurry and have access to a good service facility, you can prowl eBay (and thrift stores) for used, older SP stuff, which can be had for very little money. In SCUBA, knowledge and patience is almost always a direct trade-off for cash. ~$700 = really nice reg now. ~$150 = really nice reg when it appears used somewhere.

flots.

 

[Ulfhedinn]

My next purchase will be HOG D1 (Coldwater).

 

[LowDrag]

I am with Slater, this thread has turned out some really good info and learning. Thanks for sharing your knowledge about scuba and it's equipment.

halocline, I found a link to the Vance Harlow book just a day or so and was planning on checking it out. I am mechanically inclined as well as being very particular on how things are worked on. So, with some studying and practice I think I would be good at repairing/servicing my own reg's. Thanks for the patience while learning.

flots...Thanks to you as well for your info and patience. As you may have seen, the "life support" thought is gone and I see your point. It's goes back to being in the Army, remember your training and you will make it back.

 

[Ribellu]

Legend LX ACD Supreme (cold water compliant) in a heart beat
Can't see any flaw or defect, you can breathe through it with only one lung
The Aqualung Legend is All About Performance
A french diving magazine tested it vs Scubapro MK25 A700, Seac D Synchro, Poséidon XStream, Oceanic EOS, Seeman SL350, Mares Carbon42, Cressi Elipse Titanium, Aeris ION, Beuchat VRT 200 Po, Apelks XTX200. It was a blind test done with 5 divers, the Legend LX ACD Supreme won in 8 categories out of 10, finishing tied for 1st and second on the 2 others.
I bought it because my instructor recommended it to me, I have no regrets, I had a Mares Proton Ice before, the Legend is so much better.