Lost Improperly Tightened 2nd-Stage Regulator

[John C. Ratliff]

It happens. You've learnt now to do a pre use gear check rather than relying on a basic pre dive checks

I did similar. I was on Sidemount and the hose detached from my reg when we were at 35m (115'). No drama other than the loud noise from the hose. My SM regs were deliberately hand tight but I didn't check they were fully snugged up

My mistake of course was to spit out the non functioning reg (now not attached). By the time I'd turned off my tank (having switched regs), my wife was dangling the reg she'd fetched from the sand some 5 - 6 m below us, in front of me, laughing at me. I simply put the reg on the hose, switched on the tank and carried on with the dive, and the subsequent dives that weekend (the 1st stage was then rebuilt the following week)

I should have known better, its something I preached to my students, but I didn't. No harm and I have a "it happened to me" story to give to my students as proof we're all fallible.

Okay, I’m missing something here. Who told you guys to only hand-tighten the LP connection hose to the first stage, or the regulator for that matter? It has been standard practice for decades to tighten these down with a wrench so as to preclude this from happening (inadvertent unscrewing of the hose from the first stage). I would not dive a hand-tightened hose fitting.

SeaRat

 

[jadairiii]

Okay, I’m missing something here. Who told you guys to only hand-tighten the LP connection hose to the first stage, or the regulator for that matter? It has been standard practice for decades to tighten these down with a wrench so as to preclude this from happening (inadvertent unscrewing of the hose from the first stage). I would not dive a hand-tightened hose fitting.

SeaRat

Oddly enough, hand tightening 2nd stages was all the rage back in the mid/late 90's in Tech/Cave diving. I did it for years. "Purpose" was if you had a 2nd stage failure, especially on a deco bottle, you could just swap it with your primary and be back in business (and I actually had to do that once coming up from a 200' mix dive). Downside, they blow off. Today in tech/cave circles its not in vogue.

 

[Jcp2]

Oddly enough, hand tightening 2nd stages was all the rage back in the mid/late 90's in Tech/Cave diving. I did it for years. "Purpose" was if you had a 2nd stage failure, especially on a deco bottle, you could just swap it with your primary and be back in business (and I actually had to do that once coming up from a 200' mix dive). Downside, they blow off. Today in tech/cave circles its not in vogue.

Sounds like the answer is to carry a third unattached second stage in a pocket.

 

[John C. Ratliff]

Sounds like the answer is to carry a third unattached second stage in a pocket.

Oddly enough, hand tightening 2nd stages was all the rage back in the mid/late 90's in Tech/Cave diving. I did it for years. "Purpose" was if you had a 2nd stage failure, especially on a deco bottle, you could just swap it with your primary and be back in business (and I actually had to do that once coming up from a 200' mix dive). Downside, they blow off. Today in tech/cave circles its not in vogue.

‘Sounds to me like carrying a wrench would be a better way. By the way, if you have to remove and attach a second stage from a first stage underwater, especially in saltwater, the whole regulator needs to be cleaned before it is used again.

SeaRat

 

[Diving Dubai]

Sounds to me like carrying a wrench would be a better way.

That of course assumes all the hoses and regs require the same size since an adjustable (s) are bound to have frozen when you need them, and also you need 2 spanners to loosen/tighten a reg. If that's your preferred method, go for it, or have your hoses tight to you regs (the preferred method for 95% of dives)

Purpose" was if you had a 2nd stage failure, especially on a deco bottle, you could just swap it with your primary and be back in business

Exactly. And it's never been an issue for me before or since. I just wasn't paying attention as was on a "rec" dive

Normally I'm very diligent since most months I'd deep clean mine and my wife's BCD and remove all the dumps and corrugated inflator etc to ensure any salt and algae which might remain after normal cleaning were removed (based on both diving weekly in a very hot humid climate) Clearly that time I didn't double check one reg

if you have to remove and attach a second stage from a first stage underwater, especially in saltwater, the whole regulator needs to be cleaned before it is used again.

Well mine was cleaned 6 dives later at the end of the weekend (since we were on a boat 60 miles from port)

I've also been taught to change a 1st stage with its regs underwater if need be. Yes they'll need a rebuild after but at least you get back on to the surface without a severe issue

 

[NW Dive Dawg]

I always spin my 2nd stages pre-dive to make sure that are rotating freely on their swivels.. I rarely check the connections with wrenches but it makes sense to do so more often.....just a quick "tweak" to make sure they are snug..... (more snug than hand tight)..

As far as handling a scenario where a 2nd stage becomes dislodged, or even fails in a fully open free flow.....my personal preparedness plan is to always carry a fully on and charged back mount 19cf pony.

As far as buddies go, they can be a nice bonus if I have a problem, but my personal planning and preparedness is to assume no buddy will be available.

Just curious...... why don't 2nd stages connect with a quick connect similar to a BC - LP inflator hose? That way if there was a disconnection there would be little or no loss of primary gas so you could just swap to your alt. Also, all the techie types could carry a spare 2nd stage and just do a quick swap if ever needed...

 

[rhwestfall]

Just curious...... why don't 2nd stages connect with a quick connect similar to a BC - LP inflator hose? That way if there was a disconnection there would be little or no loss of primary gas so you could just swap to your alt. Also, all the techie types could carry a spare 2nd stage and just do a quick swap if ever needed...

They do make them (QD are at times used in FFM units). The standard ones don't allow enough gas to function for a regulator (hence the different/larger ones for the combo unit inflator/regulators.

99% of diving doesn't need them...

 

[Lorenzoid]

Just curious...... why don't 2nd stages connect with a quick connect similar to a BC - LP inflator hose? That way if there was a disconnection there would be little or no loss of primary gas so you could just swap to your alt. Also, all the techie types could carry a spare 2nd stage and just do a quick swap if ever needed...

I would weigh the pros and cons: Quick disconnects are a little more bulky/heavy and a little more expensive than a simple thread-on connector. Another disadvantage is that a QD is an added potential failure point. There's also the potential for inadvertently disconnecting, as sometimes happens with a BC inflator. Swapping out a misbehaving second stage for a replacement sounds advantageous, but it is rarely needed (underwater? Pre-dive you can swap out with a wrench). My guess is the pros do not outweigh the cons.

 

[Diving Dubai]

Swapping out a misbehaving second stage for a replacement sounds advantageous, but it is rarely needed (underwater? Pre-dive you can swap out with a wrench). My guess is the pros do not outweigh the cons.

You're exactly right.

When I posted my incident, it was to encourage people to double check their gear, since even a seasoned experienced diver can have a brain fart

Only my Side Mount and my Deco regs are configured as hand tight. Both my back mount sets and my Pony reg are all conventionally spanner tight - since I don't need that capability in BM.

Another disadvantage is that a QD is an added potential failure point.

Although I dislike the term added failure point - I will agree there's no need for added gear complexity. If you need to swap a reg or 1st stage out underwater, you're not really bothered about a 1st stage rebuild since it's not a frequent occurrence, and if you're making deco dives you like to maintain the KISS principle anyway

 

[Angelo Farina]

True, but in the worst case yout full AL80 will drain in about 2 minutes, for example a broken LP hose or lost 2nd stage. Best to go directly to the surface and not dally or do a safety stop.

Isn't is simpler to just close the valve feeding the secondary reg?
I usually simply hand-tight the hose to the second stage. And yes, a couple of times the secondary reg did unscrew partially and some air leakage occurred. In both cases I closed the valve, tightened the hose nut, and opened it again.
One should not rush to the surface for such minimal inconveniences...
We have two regs exactly for being able to overcome easily these situations.