RichLockyer
Guest
Hmm... I never thought of that before, but you're right... I haven't noticed the same cold, dry feeling since switching to the 7 footer.
Long Hose on Primary or Octo?
- Thread starter Dr. Jay
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divevawreks
Guest
If you will go out and try to share air from 100" and do a safty stop on a short hose you will buy the 7'. Chick diver mentioned how to rout the hose. this makes yr back up on a very short hose and is less drag. The 7' hose will be out of the way and in front you you. Much more stream lined and it is always a good idea to give an ooa diver the second stage that you KNOW is working. They may have had to just swim to you with empty lungs. They dont need the stress of finding out the back up doesnt work. The DIR standards are very well thought through. Go to the GUE web site for DIR info.
Ziggys_Friend
Guest
I'm with MHK all the way on this. I've just switched to a 7' long hose for my primary and I can't imagine ever going back. No, I don't have a canister light yet and I want my knife to the left of my belt buckle, so I just tuck the excess hose into my belt.
Having done several OOA drills as part of my DIR-F course I can definitely speak to the advantages of the long hose. Sure, it sounds great to say in an OOA situation to hold on to each other, but when the S@#$ hits the fan that extra flexibility is a Godsend.
Example one, we're down 40' and one of us goes OOA, no problem I'm there to donate my primary and easily switch to my back-up. However, now another team member looses his mask and my buddy sees it and I don't. Without thinking he's trying to help that buddy. Without that 7' he would have left his air supply behind.
Example two, we're swimming along and my buddy looses his mask. Moments later I'm OOA and signaling him (hand signals since he can't see) that I need his reg. Okay so far, but now we need to make a controlled ascent and we're both battling buoyancy issues. The 7' makes all the difference in the world believe me.
One other word for consistency. Despite it's advantages, a long hose does take some getting used to. That's especially true in deploying it in an OOA situation (handing it off, freeing it from your belt or canister, two tugs to make sure it's free). Switching lengths seems an unnecessary recipe for confusion.
~<//><
Having done several OOA drills as part of my DIR-F course I can definitely speak to the advantages of the long hose. Sure, it sounds great to say in an OOA situation to hold on to each other, but when the S@#$ hits the fan that extra flexibility is a Godsend.
Example one, we're down 40' and one of us goes OOA, no problem I'm there to donate my primary and easily switch to my back-up. However, now another team member looses his mask and my buddy sees it and I don't. Without thinking he's trying to help that buddy. Without that 7' he would have left his air supply behind.
Example two, we're swimming along and my buddy looses his mask. Moments later I'm OOA and signaling him (hand signals since he can't see) that I need his reg. Okay so far, but now we need to make a controlled ascent and we're both battling buoyancy issues. The 7' makes all the difference in the world believe me.
One other word for consistency. Despite it's advantages, a long hose does take some getting used to. That's especially true in deploying it in an OOA situation (handing it off, freeing it from your belt or canister, two tugs to make sure it's free). Switching lengths seems an unnecessary recipe for confusion.
~<//><
Hi guys
What I would like to know is, how prevalent do you reckon DIR is in the US? Is it becoming a common method of teaching beginners?
It's gaining ground here in the UK, but veeeeryyyy sloooooowwwwwlyyyyyyy, almost entirely by word of mouth.
Also, does anyone know if there has been any reaction by the major training agencies? I'm curious because the British Sub Aqua Club thinks donating a long hose is too difficult for beginners...duh!
cheers
Rich
What I would like to know is, how prevalent do you reckon DIR is in the US? Is it becoming a common method of teaching beginners?
It's gaining ground here in the UK, but veeeeryyyy sloooooowwwwwlyyyyyyy, almost entirely by word of mouth.
Also, does anyone know if there has been any reaction by the major training agencies? I'm curious because the British Sub Aqua Club thinks donating a long hose is too difficult for beginners...duh!
cheers
Rich
mgri
Guest
On the same lines.. something I don't understand is if all the evidence states that a diver in an OOA situation will go for your primary why do the agency teach to donate your secondary?
Donating a secondary can't be less difficult than donating a long hose. At least you know exactly where your primary is and you don't have to hunt for it.
Seems like the only time donating a secondary is easier is in a pool where the OOA is simulated and your not dealing with a panicked diver.
Donating a secondary can't be less difficult than donating a long hose. At least you know exactly where your primary is and you don't have to hunt for it.
Seems like the only time donating a secondary is easier is in a pool where the OOA is simulated and your not dealing with a panicked diver.
Two words: "Litigation paralysis" -- do a search on that and not only will you find an excellent discussion on which reg to donate, but in one of my responses I define "litigation paralysis" which is why so many agencies are stuck teaching donating the octo.
Roak
mgri
Guest
awww yes, how silly of me. I forgot that corporations and agencies don't live in our world of reality and common sense
Thanks Roak
To use a long hose or not this is not even a question. The question is where to put it.
To my opinion, and this is the way i dive, the long hose has to b on the octopus.
This is for several reasons.
1. If my buddy will grab my octopus he will take the long hose and use it. We will not have to change regs.
2. If i have to give someone in stress the octopus i reach and take the octopus with the long hose and give it to him.
i dont like to dive with the long hose because if there is a situation that someone is in stress i have to take out the reg from my mouth and give it to him. If everything is well then he takes the reg and i take my reg and we both r ok.
But, if if the diver is in stress and i have to calm him down while giving him my reg(with the long hose) and during this action i have to control the diver ,i dont want to look for my reg, even if its hanging on my neck.
Donno how many of u had this situation but if u had it then u know that the last thing u need when u r dealing with a stressed hysteric diver under water is another factor to take care of.
mark
To my opinion, and this is the way i dive, the long hose has to b on the octopus.
This is for several reasons.
1. If my buddy will grab my octopus he will take the long hose and use it. We will not have to change regs.
2. If i have to give someone in stress the octopus i reach and take the octopus with the long hose and give it to him.
i dont like to dive with the long hose because if there is a situation that someone is in stress i have to take out the reg from my mouth and give it to him. If everything is well then he takes the reg and i take my reg and we both r ok.
But, if if the diver is in stress and i have to calm him down while giving him my reg(with the long hose) and during this action i have to control the diver ,i dont want to look for my reg, even if its hanging on my neck.
Donno how many of u had this situation but if u had it then u know that the last thing u need when u r dealing with a stressed hysteric diver under water is another factor to take care of.
mark
JohnF
Guest
Are you always positive your secondary is in good working order when you hand it off? If you donate the primary you know it works, you've been breathing it. You are less stressed than the OOA diver you're helping and should be in a better state of mind to deal with a messed-up secondary. Which brings up the other advantage of breathing the long hose. It allows you to necklace your secondary so it's in a better spot not to pick up bottom crud etc.
JohnF
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