Liability of Agencies for their instructors??

[Eric Sedletzky]

There is a huge difference between those who post and those who lurk. Those who lurk are here only to research.

I’m sure you can see real numbers on your end of the screen of how many times a thread is viewed both by non members and subscribed members.
So what is the ratio. 20:1 , 100:1 ?
Is there any way to know who they are?
I am pretty vested in my local dive scene. I talk to a lot of people. Most people in our local dive community have never even heard of scubaboard. But that probably isn’t saying much since we are a very fringe community here in Norcal.

 

[The Chairman]

Most people in our local dive community have never even heard of scubaboard.

This is true to some extent. When we used to have a booth at DEMA, it was quite common for people to say they had never heard of us. Then they would sit down and start to browse our site and exclaim, "Oh, I've been here before!" Would I love us to be bigger? Sure. Much of our traffic was sucked off by Facebook, etc.

 

[Cthippo]

I would love to see the agencies step up and offer a premium OW course for those willing that have the time and the money. Right now it seems you either pick a run of the mill style abbreviated course from one of the ABC agencies (slightly better for a local course), or you pick GUE.
There’s nothing in between.

There is and most programs offer it. It's called private instruction where you get to take longer and ask all the questions you want. I went that route which is why my OW course cost $1000. Worth it.

The problem right now as I see it is there isn’t enough time in the day to teach enough skills to set these new divers free into the wild with enough information and confidence to know what to do in the event of any given mishap without a total panic. The culture right now is to crank out as many new divers as possible with bare minimum skills. I blame the vacation/resort setting for this, where most divers explore diving and get their certifications. It’s really a catch 22. They are taught barely enough to not die, but not enough to be comfortable and confident.

I think this is only partly an instructor problem. People today grew up with different experiences and skill sets. More and more people are reaching their 40s and 50s, the point where they can afford to dive, having never been comfortable in the water. A dive instructpr cannot also be a swimming instructor.

We were recently having this discussion aboout new firefighters and how we are having people coming in who grew up in the city and have no idea how to use a wheelbarrow. Yeah, I try to avoid the "kids these days" trope, but when you grew up in the 1980s and 1990s stranger danger. Satanists behind every bush, just say no to drugs moral panic or tje post 9-11 era, people today grew up kuch more sheltered and especially are less likely to be comfortable in water that earlier generations. A dive instructor cannot fix that in 3 days.

Likewise , even with the best instructon in the world, you cannot remain competent diving once a year on vacation. The vast majority of the divers I meet are warm water vacation ONLY divers who wouldn't dive locally if you paid them. Again, you have to meet the customers where they are.

Diving is not growing.

I don't know of any outdoor sport that is growing.

 

[The Chairman]

people today grew up with different experiences and skill sets.

Today, many just want to experience it once. They don't have time to develop skills.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Today, many just want to experience it once. They don't have time to develop skills.

There is a trend towards everything being more of a virtual world and not so much of a manual physical world.
It used to be that you had to go out and experience the world, now they sit on their phones and watch Instagram reels.
I blame technology gone wrong.

 

[The Chairman]

I blame technology gone wrong.

Blame? We're evolving along with our technology. We're going to figure this all out eventually. We can't blame people for wanting things to change or to be easy.

That's just it. We deserve the students we attract. If you only want the creme de la creme, like GUE, you use the right verbiage and attract the very best. If you want the crud de la crud, you offer easy and cheap. I was somewhere in the middle of that spectrum.

It's long been my opinion that we are our own worst enemies. We often get what we deserve, and then bitterly complain about it. Point fingers all you want. It's your business to succeed or fail in. You will get the students you advertise for: the very students you deserve.

 

[Pressurehead]

which is why my OW course cost $1000. Worth it.

One on one with an instructor who will put the extra effort in, I would say 'that was a bargain', I was charging that [and more] years ago, this was years ago you did this course ?

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Today, many just want to experience it once. They don't have time to develop skills.

There's not a lot of money in that market segment except in places where cost of living is super cheap.

The most successful shops in my area have repeat customers and offer quality/smaller classes.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Blame? We're evolving along with our technology. We're going to figure this all out eventually. We can't blame people for wanting things to change or to be easy.

That's just it. We deserve the students we attract. If you only want the creme de la creme, like GUE, you use the right verbiage and attract the very best. If you want the crud de la crud, you offer easy and cheap. I was somewhere in the middle of that spectrum.

It's long been my opinion that we are our own worst enemies. We often get what we deserve, and then bitterly complain about it. Point fingers all you want. It's your business to succeed or fail in. You will get the students you advertise for: the very students you deserve.

I probably should have worded it better, like: Technology in some cases has gone wrong.
But whatever….
I don’t know that I so much blame, it’s more of an observation. After all, scuba equipment and diving was a technological advancement along with a the nuclear weapon.
Everything is a technological advancement.
I guess in a highly protective and paranoid world like what @Cthippo pointed out with the most protected generation growing up bubble wrapped with evil lurking in every shadow. It’s true!
Those children grew up in an indoor environment playing video games in a virtual world because the world was much too dangerous to be allowed to go outside and play. And, computer technology was beginning to take off so yeah there were a lot of video games! A perfect storm.
Developers made a bloody fortune off that technology. Developers in the computer and technology industry have made unfathomable amounts of money in the last 50 years. Why would they want it any other way? They are the ones inventing this stuff and setting the principle, the people just follow and use what they develop.
All this takes away from physical activities. Why are people so obese these days, even from childhood? With all this available information at your fingertips tips shouldn’t it be the other way around?
Very strange times indeed.

 

[Cthippo]

One on one with an instructor who will put the extra effort in, I would say 'that was a bargain', I was charging that [and more] years ago, this was years ago you did this course ?

It was 2 or 3 years ago. Late Covid era.