LeisurePro vs. LDS - reg unassembled?
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Funny how far the price fixing goes around here. My LDS charges 84.00 for a yearly service.
I called a competitor, and they charge $100.00 for a 'grey market' reg & octo service.
It seems that the local dive shops have gotten together to be sure that if any of their customers buy grey market, they screw them when it comes to serviceing the stuff.
So here is what I am considering: Buying my BCD & Computer from LP.
Buy my reg and octo from LDS. Just so I don't get screwed on the yearly service. After all, I am not going to be diving but 2 weeks a year - unless I get lucky.
Now my question is this: How often do you have your BCD and Computer serviced? Is this type of service much cheaper? (I am assuming that BCD's don't need to be serviced every year, and computers don't need to be serviced at all - hopefully).
Question 2: If you go into you LDS and buy a new reg, but you have your computer and octo already, can you expect that they would connect them all to the first stage? (I would assume they would if you are 'upgrading' just the reg in your equipment - but I have a feeling that they might NOT if they know you are buying from LP. Just to be 'that way').
Thanks for your help =)
p.s. Mike - I am interested on your input on what I am getting charged for a yearly service on a Grey market reg. I assume the overhaul kit for an Aqualung Titan LX is about $10, would you charge me $40-60 for the parts in addition to your yearly service fee? Basically, what would you charge me if I brought it into your shop?
I called a competitor, and they charge $100.00 for a 'grey market' reg & octo service.
It seems that the local dive shops have gotten together to be sure that if any of their customers buy grey market, they screw them when it comes to serviceing the stuff.
So here is what I am considering: Buying my BCD & Computer from LP.
Buy my reg and octo from LDS. Just so I don't get screwed on the yearly service. After all, I am not going to be diving but 2 weeks a year - unless I get lucky.
Now my question is this: How often do you have your BCD and Computer serviced? Is this type of service much cheaper? (I am assuming that BCD's don't need to be serviced every year, and computers don't need to be serviced at all - hopefully).
Question 2: If you go into you LDS and buy a new reg, but you have your computer and octo already, can you expect that they would connect them all to the first stage? (I would assume they would if you are 'upgrading' just the reg in your equipment - but I have a feeling that they might NOT if they know you are buying from LP. Just to be 'that way').
Thanks for your help =)
p.s. Mike - I am interested on your input on what I am getting charged for a yearly service on a Grey market reg. I assume the overhaul kit for an Aqualung Titan LX is about $10, would you charge me $40-60 for the parts in addition to your yearly service fee? Basically, what would you charge me if I brought it into your shop?
Addict,
First off when someone brings in a reg for service, I don't know where they got it. If the serial number is ground off (which I don't think happens as much anymore) I won't touch it for any amount of money. That is something that my insurance company more or less forbids me to do.
We don't service many brands because to service we must be authorized to do so by the manufacturer and to do that we must "buy" a dealership and sell the brand. We just can't sell the regs with a large on-line presence. I also can't even come close to a Aqualung or Scubapro dealership. Don't have that kind of money and will not give them control of my soul for the privilage of licking their bottoms.
Ok back to the toppic - a rebuild kit for a Zeagle reg costs me (I just callled my wife to find out) $32. That is for the first stage and two second stages. A kit for a sherwood only costs me about $8.
We currently charge $35 for servicing. However, that cost was based on the false assumption that we were going to be servicing regulators we sold and I haven't sold but 4 or 5 regs so far this year. Also, thats what the shlock shops in the area were charging.
If you send a sherwood reg to Crammer and decker (the distributor) they charge $75 (last I knew and from memmory). I think that's for a first and two seconds. Labor charged for reg servicing really needs to be at least an hour. Some can take longer than that just to clean. IMO, $60 or so is reasonable. For less than that for an hours work, I need to skip it and do something else.
The cost of service will go up. Not because of price fixing but because we don't sell equipment so service can no longer be a loss leader.
On the other hand it will never be a real profit center because there are so few brands that we can service. I have been negotiating with manufacturers and insurance companies for years and they won't budge. Service is such a small part of our business that for what we make I would prefer not to pull out the tools and mess up the bench not to mention the risk exposure.
Just to put things in perspective, it would cost me $18,000 for a SP dealorship. Then I need to sell that much or more every year just to keep the line. Oh, and I would have to travel to DEMA to get the repair class (which is a joke). And I would have to let them tell me what other stuff I can carry and I would have to lie to my student because I would be obligated to buy the whole SP line and sell it even though I think most of it is junk.
So after spending many thousands of dollars and taking on significant risks, I could service a reg and be accused of gouging if I charged anywhere near enough to ever make back my investment. This is the situation the manufacturers put us in.
I guess I told you way more than you asked but I really want divers to understand what a diveshop is.
First off when someone brings in a reg for service, I don't know where they got it. If the serial number is ground off (which I don't think happens as much anymore) I won't touch it for any amount of money. That is something that my insurance company more or less forbids me to do.
We don't service many brands because to service we must be authorized to do so by the manufacturer and to do that we must "buy" a dealership and sell the brand. We just can't sell the regs with a large on-line presence. I also can't even come close to a Aqualung or Scubapro dealership. Don't have that kind of money and will not give them control of my soul for the privilage of licking their bottoms.
Ok back to the toppic - a rebuild kit for a Zeagle reg costs me (I just callled my wife to find out) $32. That is for the first stage and two second stages. A kit for a sherwood only costs me about $8.
We currently charge $35 for servicing. However, that cost was based on the false assumption that we were going to be servicing regulators we sold and I haven't sold but 4 or 5 regs so far this year. Also, thats what the shlock shops in the area were charging.
If you send a sherwood reg to Crammer and decker (the distributor) they charge $75 (last I knew and from memmory). I think that's for a first and two seconds. Labor charged for reg servicing really needs to be at least an hour. Some can take longer than that just to clean. IMO, $60 or so is reasonable. For less than that for an hours work, I need to skip it and do something else.
The cost of service will go up. Not because of price fixing but because we don't sell equipment so service can no longer be a loss leader.
On the other hand it will never be a real profit center because there are so few brands that we can service. I have been negotiating with manufacturers and insurance companies for years and they won't budge. Service is such a small part of our business that for what we make I would prefer not to pull out the tools and mess up the bench not to mention the risk exposure.
Just to put things in perspective, it would cost me $18,000 for a SP dealorship. Then I need to sell that much or more every year just to keep the line. Oh, and I would have to travel to DEMA to get the repair class (which is a joke). And I would have to let them tell me what other stuff I can carry and I would have to lie to my student because I would be obligated to buy the whole SP line and sell it even though I think most of it is junk.
So after spending many thousands of dollars and taking on significant risks, I could service a reg and be accused of gouging if I charged anywhere near enough to ever make back my investment. This is the situation the manufacturers put us in.
I guess I told you way more than you asked but I really want divers to understand what a diveshop is.
R
redacted
Guest
Addict
Your LDS's are threatening to stick it to you so you think you will knuckle under - another LDS success story. Are you really going to be satisfied with that?
There are other options for service. This operation in CA looks like it will do the work.
http://www.diversdiscount.com/resources/frameset-search.asp
I recall another in FL but don't have the link handy. There prices are in line with what Mike F is saying and not entirely out of line with what your LDS is quoting. Even LP will do the servicing. Another option is to send it to the mfgr. Scubapro spells that out as a specific option in their users manual.
The rub is what they are really going to do for that price. With some LDSs, that should be a major concern. Are thay going to do what Mike described, or will they take some shortcuts? And how will you know.
I do my own & I don't have a lot of experience. I 'service' my reg often (monthly or more). But that service is usually visual inspection, check IP & dive it. Sometimes I'll also fill the sink and check cracking pressure. During the set-up and dive I'm "checking" for leaks and performance. After a SW dive, I put it in the tub and check for leaks and maybe cracking pressure. In 4 years on my Mk20/G500, I have inspected,dissassembled, cleaned, inspected, lubed, reassembled, and inspected the Mk20 twice. No parts used yet. I've also adjusted the G500 twice in that time - no dissassembly beyond that needed to adjust. When I did disassemble the Mk20, it took me a couple hours. The point is, you may think you are getting a full annual service, but when the bill is only $35.00, they may have just inspected and adjusted it and are now betting your satisfaction (and maybe your saa) that it will go another year. Or the bill may be the full $100.00 and still little was actually done.
Your LDS has clearly shown that it doesn't mind ripping you off. I know I wouldn't trust them for much more than an airfill. If you can't find someone you trust, at least find someone who isn't overcharging you.
Too bad Mike won't do MO service.
Your LDS's are threatening to stick it to you so you think you will knuckle under - another LDS success story. Are you really going to be satisfied with that?
There are other options for service. This operation in CA looks like it will do the work.
http://www.diversdiscount.com/resources/frameset-search.asp
I recall another in FL but don't have the link handy. There prices are in line with what Mike F is saying and not entirely out of line with what your LDS is quoting. Even LP will do the servicing. Another option is to send it to the mfgr. Scubapro spells that out as a specific option in their users manual.
The rub is what they are really going to do for that price. With some LDSs, that should be a major concern. Are thay going to do what Mike described, or will they take some shortcuts? And how will you know.
I do my own & I don't have a lot of experience. I 'service' my reg often (monthly or more). But that service is usually visual inspection, check IP & dive it. Sometimes I'll also fill the sink and check cracking pressure. During the set-up and dive I'm "checking" for leaks and performance. After a SW dive, I put it in the tub and check for leaks and maybe cracking pressure. In 4 years on my Mk20/G500, I have inspected,dissassembled, cleaned, inspected, lubed, reassembled, and inspected the Mk20 twice. No parts used yet. I've also adjusted the G500 twice in that time - no dissassembly beyond that needed to adjust. When I did disassemble the Mk20, it took me a couple hours. The point is, you may think you are getting a full annual service, but when the bill is only $35.00, they may have just inspected and adjusted it and are now betting your satisfaction (and maybe your saa) that it will go another year. Or the bill may be the full $100.00 and still little was actually done.
Your LDS has clearly shown that it doesn't mind ripping you off. I know I wouldn't trust them for much more than an airfill. If you can't find someone you trust, at least find someone who isn't overcharging you.
Too bad Mike won't do MO service.
We will do MO service for the brands we can. I think there are few shops that would jaw bone the job. I have seen many recently serviced regs not assembled correctly. I think it is just slopy work rather than willfull dishonesty.
I have no problem with MO or internet business. On the contrary, I am in favor of anything that can increase my market. We are slowly and carefully working toward adding on-line sales to our site. We will still be severly limited as to what we can offer in both selection and price (at least in the biginning).
I have no problem with MO or internet business. On the contrary, I am in favor of anything that can increase my market. We are slowly and carefully working toward adding on-line sales to our site. We will still be severly limited as to what we can offer in both selection and price (at least in the biginning).
DazedAndConfuzed
Contributor
LP told me that they match all manufacturer's warranty and benefits, including the ones that offers free part during servicing. You just have to pay labor. But if you don't live near LP, shipping it back and forth might not make it economical.
mndolphin
Guest
I have read quite a bit about LDS prices and while I cannot afford them and will be buying my stuff at LP or DIVEINN, I keep hearing about the 100% mark up LDS's offer.
Ihave been in retail for almost 20 years and must tell you, most stores charge 150% mark up. LDS charge quite a bit more than online but, so does target, marshall fields and every other bussiness out there. You are paying for their overhead and expertise.
I'm not saying I agree with anyone but, Mikes right when he talks about his bottom line and why he can't afford to charge what LP does. Many companies charge a buy in, where you have to buy so many items or so many $$$ in order to carry their stuff.
I am still buying online as Thats what I can afford but, I would much rather buy fromLDS if their prices were closer.
Ihave been in retail for almost 20 years and must tell you, most stores charge 150% mark up. LDS charge quite a bit more than online but, so does target, marshall fields and every other bussiness out there. You are paying for their overhead and expertise.
I'm not saying I agree with anyone but, Mikes right when he talks about his bottom line and why he can't afford to charge what LP does. Many companies charge a buy in, where you have to buy so many items or so many $$$ in order to carry their stuff.
I am still buying online as Thats what I can afford but, I would much rather buy fromLDS if their prices were closer.
Because you are not purchasing the gear from them. As a LDS employee I can't say I blame them but that is bad customer service and will likely drive away any future purchases you may make. I would say a fair charge will be $20 per set.
How have they treated you on the customer service end? If they have been good to you try to support them. LDS' of the lifeblood of the scuba industry.
How have they treated you on the customer service end? If they have been good to you try to support them. LDS' of the lifeblood of the scuba industry.
I ended up buying through LP and they assembled my regulator, octo, and computer for free... yes in fact - it is only screwing the hoses into the correct ports.
I wouldn't have minded having them bench tested also but LP does not fix equipment, they just replace it.
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