Just bought these

[ClayJar]

It seems to me as if something like this might be a reasonable idea, at least for some gear configurations. Basically, the concept is simply to tighten the shoulders by taking the slack through the waist belt.

Of primary importance to such a rig system is considering what becomes of the rig in the event of a buckle release. It appears that the system as posted (in both the special plate and the roller add-on cases) loses all shoulder strap integrity in the event of a buckle release. That could easily be addressed by adding a "stopper" to prevent more than a given length of webbing from escaping through the slide (or roller) should the buckle release. Having a stopper would prevent complete strap failure in the event of a buckle release -- although the shoulder straps will be extremely loose, they will still be closed loops, and the situation can be managed. For a simple failure, you'd merely refasten the buckle. For a total failure, it might not be the most comfortable dive ever, but you won't find yourself attached to your rig by only your mouthpiece.

Obviously, you'll still need to adjust the D-rings (hip and shoulder) to take into account the different fit between, say, a skin and a drysuit with fleece. You'd have to do those adjustments regardless of whether you used a traditional rig or a "sliding shoulders" rig, but given the ease of the webbing adjustment (i.e. practically nothing at all), you should make special note not to ignore the D-rings, lest they become useless at times.

(When the webbing adjustments are so trivial as to be virtually unnoticed, it's easy to get lazy with the D-rings. That's no more a problem with the system than having extra contingency gas in a pony is a problem with your back gas.)

I'd be interested in seeing something like this with no rollers, perhaps using a []-ring (i.e. like a D-ring, but rectangular -- 2 inches wide any maybe half an inch open). That would be narrow enough that a D-ring (or just a single-bar slide or "keeper") could perform the function of "stopper".

 

[Clanggedin]

OK.. So technically these rollers will allow me to loan my BP/W to someone else without having to spend time
re-adjusting the shoulder straps for them?

How long does it take to adjust shoulder straps without this?

I don't have a BP/W setup and I am planning on getting one. Is there that big of a difference??

 

[Blackwood]

How long does it take to adjust shoulder straps without this?

Not long at all. But you have to be careful when you trim the webbing. I trimmed mine to be just right in my drysuit. I can tighten it up for my wetsuit, but I can't lend it to anyone bigger than me-in-my-DS without re webbing it.

 

[Drewski]

I'll post some pictures tonight of the harness I made using these rollers and maybe it will make the advantages somewhat clearer.

I think George's intent in making these was for a "minimalist" and "ease of use" approach. Most of the diving they do in Morehead City is wet, and the boat DMs use them to get in and out of their gear quickly. The rollers also move the attachment point for the waist out about 2". I've found this position makes it easier to clear reels and other stuff suspended from the rear of the waist strap.

I originally tried this set-up in "Hog" style and didn't like it. On me, it pulled the straps to the shoulders too much. I split the straps top/bottom and added D-rings and a chest strap to angle the attachment points. I also added downward facing D-rings for BU light attachment and lower profile (see pics later).

To solve the "mouthpiece" only attachment potential, I added heavy duty Billy rings on each side toward the back of the waist strap. I left about 4" of play which allows me to disconnect the waist buckle, pull or "hunch up" on my harness and easily clear my arms when wearing a Viking drysuit.

The major advantage of this system is that it eliminates plastic "quick connect" buckles in the shoulder harness but still allows for the "pull down" close fit.

 

[jim T.]

It would seem that this "system" would allow easier doffing of one's rig in the water in an emergency without the use of plastic quick releases or cutting of webbing. Am I missing something? If so that could be a nice safety advantage or increase the ease of removing rig and connecting to an equipment line. That doesn't seem to be a solution in search of a problem for some. People with reduced shoulder movement due to injuries, age, arthritis, etc. There are plenty more of those divers than people on the boards seem to want to recognize in my opinion. If they do indeed allow easier reach for back up lights, lift bags, etc. what's so bad about that? A stopper on the "bitter end" of the waist strap is no big deal and I've certainly seen plenty of them in use. If this thing offers some use advantages without decreasing safety what's the big deal?

For travel, even though it isn't a huge deal to move traditional Hog harness webbing, being able to do it in seconds seems like an "ok" objective to me. I'd have to see/try them to decide if they're a useful idea or more trouble than they're worth, but I'd be willing to as least check them out before putting them down outright. Moving D rings is much faster and easier than keepers on the shoulder straps, usually.
George Purifoy has been diving some serious dives a hell of a lot longer than a lot of people here, maybe he's not nuts.
Wasn't he the guy who designed/made the infamous Doria grate and lock?

What do they cost? No one has said as of yet.

 

[rawls]

You have all made very good points. George and Jon have simply presented an alternative harness system that makes it easier to get into and out of and that snugs on the shoulders really well. I am 6'4 and have had a really tough time finding a harness that fits well. I am one of those in between sizes...either the harness is too big or it's too small. With this system I have found it to give me a custom fit and I can't express how nice it is to finally have it. As far as the buckle coming undone, I have never had that experience with any rig. If those of you are concerned of the whole belt escaping through the rollers...I have 2 D-rings on my waist belt that would prevent that, so all I would have to do would be to simply reconnect the belt.

Unlike the OP, I use a split harness system that I made for a lower profile tighter fitting set-up. It allows tightening underwater or loosening above water by just pulling.

Drewski...Your system sounds very interesting and I would love for you to post some pics

I think George's intent in making these was for a "minimalist" and "ease of use" approach.

Exactly...I have told people the same thing...It is very minimalist and very easy to use. And you are very correct...We dive wet most of the time. I use a 7mm up through December and have even used it in February....But it works just as well with the drysuit too....

People with reduced shoulder movement due to injuries, age, arthritis, etc. There are plenty more of those divers than people on the boards seem to want to recognize in my opinion

Jim...I have already talked with a member of this board about the same thing regarding physical reduced range of motion as well as compromising injuries.

Wasn't he the guy who designed/made the infamous Doria grate and lock?

I think that was Chatterton that did the grate. George and John are long time friends and John uses the rollers with his rig. But the 2 have a common bond in that George is the one, along with 3 close friends that discovered the U-352. I took 10 years to find the wreck which they finally located in April of 1975


COST.......$120

 

[dkatchalov]

COST The set is a bit pricey...well it is actually pretty cheap considering what we pay for gear on average...The set is $120...

$120?!!

that is more than double of what my oms plate cost me!!

wow!

 

[rawls]

$120?!!

that is more than double of what my oms plate cost me!!

For me, it was some of the best money I have spent on a piece of dive equipment...I no doubt can't speak for everyone.

One thing I have told others who have PM'd me....I am not making one penny of comission

 

[HenrikBP]

Wouldn't the left side waist D-ring with keeper prevent the left side of the harness/waist strap from slipping clear through the roller? And a can light with buckle keeper prevent the right side from slipping?

Henrik

 

[mmadiver]

Make the rollers only be able to roll one way that way they will never loosen only tighten. Like those locking cleats for sailboats. Or have a little tab that you can push down to lock them in place like on a tape measure. Problem solved.