In search of the driest upside-down breather...Atomics Z2x...your thoughts?

[Hatul]

Simple physics make it impossible for a single hose regulator to breath as easily upside down as right side up:

But then there is this, a Voit Navy with Phoenix conversion, smooth, dry, breaths great upside down:

The old Omega II and Tekna T2100 servo valve regulators did OK upside down but they tended to breath wet like all side exhaust regulators tend to, espeically the Omega.

N

Thanks for the explanation. But this does not explain why there is a difference among regs in how they breathe inverted. Atomic owners seem to have no problem breathing upside down, sideways or which way. Is there some magic thingy that allows them to violate the laws of physics?

Adam

 

[fnfalman]

Atomic owners seem to have no problem breathing upside down, sideways or which way. Is there some magic thingy that allows them to violate the laws of physics?

Adam

That's why it's called "Atomic" Aquatics, silly!!!

I have no stinking idea why, I just know that Atomic regulators work really well. Atomic's top dogs are not just engineers but divers as well, and they dive on regular basis here in SoCal. They also have open houses with various Atomic dealing shops and would go out and talk with divers, getting feedbacks about their gears.

It's not one of those, nod, nod, aha, damn good idea, shaking hands deal either. I was talking with Dean about his spring traps may need more adjustment for tiny feet people and he whipped out his note pad to write it down.

 

[Nemrod]

Thanks for the explanation. But this does not explain why there is a difference among regs in how they breathe inverted. Atomic owners seem to have no problem breathing upside down, sideways or which way. Is there some magic thingy that allows them to violate the laws of physics?

Adam

I have dove with Atomic regulators, no, they do not defy physics, they experience the same forces in exactly the same way as any single hose regulator. Their regulators are not the only ones that seem to defy (but do not) physics. They are just very well engineered, have a good ratio of diaphragm area, low internal friction and leverage to minimize mechanical drag and minimize your demand effort.

The old Scubapro R109 can breath nicely upside down because you can turn the adjustment knob way out. As well as low cracking effort and low mechanical drag, some regulators have a more effective venturi action that others such that once flow is established they seem effortless. That is why they put that vane in some regs to destroy the venturi effect so it does not free flow wildly when out of your mouth--the dive/pre dive lever or whatever they call it these days.

No mystery, physical laws do not bend for Atomics, gravity has not been eliminated though Boeing is working on it, shhhhhhh.

N

 

[Belce]

Scubapro A700 as dry up down, rightside up or down

 

[Kunundrum]

My Aqualung legend Breath great in any position without any leaks.

and if you wand a Side exhaust the Aqualung Kronos is a great reg too.

 

[Diver0001]

My Aqualung legend Breath great in any position without any leaks.

This is my experience too but I didn't want to post that because I think the OP may be setting the bar higher than any reg on the market can deliver.

R..

 

[rcs9250]

The phenomenon of regulators breathing wet and dry is an old one. Even amongst identical models some will some won't. The reason that it is possible for them to breathe wet is what is called case geometry fault. It boils down to simple physics.
When a reg is in the typical diver horizontal position the exhaust valve is below the mouthpiece. This puts more pressure on the exhaust valve , aiding in keeping it closed. When the reg is inverted 180 degrees there is less pressure on it and can allow water to pass.
This can be cured with the addition of a very light spring putting pressure on the valve but then would increase the exhalation effort so it is not done.
Why amongst identical models some will and some won't is hottly debated. as some have noted that their regs breathed nice and dry till it was rebuilt.
A number of years back rebuild kits for second stages included exhaust valves. They stopped doing that as materials were improved and it was replaced only when warranted , i.e. cracks drying etc.
Scientists are still trying to figure out why a flag snaps at the edge when the wind blows. Maybe they can work on this as well.

 

[coralcruiser]

BTW.... some of the regulators that people have been commenting on as great in breathing in position (espepcially atomics) are piston regs.

I just had 2 omegas completely rebuilt and can't wait to jump into the ocean next weekend when I head down to Coz to give em a good try out!

Am not sure if I will keep the spare omega as a back up, use it as an octo or just sell it off but IMHO nothing compares to a servo-assist, side exhaust!

I still think I will get a new 1st since mine is one heavy sob... might even consider trading my omega for an apek DST or xtx 1st.

 

[Nemrod]

BTW.... some of the regulators that people have been commenting on as great in breathing in position (espepcially atomics) are piston regs.

I just had 2 omegas completely rebuilt and can't wait to jump into the ocean next weekend when I head down to Coz to give em a good try out!

Am not sure if I will keep the spare omega as a back up, use it as an octo or just sell it off but IMHO nothing compares to a servo-assist, side exhaust!

I still think I will get a new 1st since mine is one heavy sob... might even consider trading my omega for an apek DST or xtx 1st.

I bought Omegas for my wife circa 1986 or a bit. She complained constantly about the wet breathing. They seem to breath wetter than the similar Tekna T2100 which I used throughout the 80s and into the 90s. I finally gave up and got her something different to satisfy her with to stop the complaining. The Omegas breath nicely but they are a bit wet though I always thought she made to big of a deal over it. The first stage is a MkV clone and I always liked them because they were small and compact and not especially heavy, lol. I sold the Omegas off on eBay.

N

 

[John C. Ratliff]

The phenomenon of regulators breathing wet and dry is an old one. Even amongst identical models some will some won't. The reason that it is possible for them to breathe wet is what is called case geometry fault. It boils down to simple physics.
When a reg is in the typical diver horizontal position the exhaust valve is below the mouthpiece. This puts more pressure on the exhaust valve , aiding in keeping it closed. When the reg is inverted 180 degrees there is less pressure on it and can allow water to pass.
This can be cured with the addition of a very light spring putting pressure on the valve but then would increase the exhalation effort so it is not done.
Why amongst identical models some will and some won't is hottly debated. as some have noted that their regs breathed nice and dry till it was rebuilt.
A number of years back rebuild kits for second stages included exhaust valves. They stopped doing that as materials were improved and it was replaced only when warranted , i.e. cracks drying etc.
Scientists are still trying to figure out why a flag snaps at the edge when the wind blows. Maybe they can work on this as well.

I added some emphasis to the quote above, as there was a regulator a while back (1970s, I think) which incorporated a weight behind the mushroom exhaust valve to act like the spring that you mention. I can visualize that regulator, and I think it was a plastic one--I cannot remember who manufactured it though. Maybe it was the same people who put together the At-Pak, but that is just speculation on my part. But it was out there for awhile.

SeaRat