If you could change one thing about the dive industry, what would it be??

[Firebrand]

I would raise the minimum passing grade on the exams. I mean, I don't think 75% instills the necessary knowledge to be effective. When you're underwater, would you have the confidence in a buddy who can only do the requirements to 75%? I wouldn't.

 

[IceDiverInCA]

Big James, I'm from UCLA not CAL.

... but Cal put up a better fight against USC.
I still commend you for putting up a better fight than Oklahoma did.

Sincerely,

A USC alumnus :10:

P.S.

Thread hijack in progress.....

 

[TheRedHead]

As an extension of that - I've even heard tell of commercial vehicle "license mills" where the students pay their money and are given the exact questions and answers to study for the motor vehicle test they will be taking to receive their license, and are taken for road 'lessons' on the exact route they will do for their road test OOA or have lost their mask/reg/whatever and don't know how to deal with it........

During our OW written test, our instructor left the answer key on his desk, gave a little wink, and walked out of the room. I was prepared to take my test, but some of the students knew what was coming (a common practice at the LDS) and took their answers right from the sheet.

I think classes should be limited in size to 4 students per instructor (regardless of the number of assistants). My class had 14 or 15 students and we spent most of the time planted on the bottom waiting to do our skills. I think the LDS deliberately turned down the heater on their pool to 76 degrees during the OW classes. We all had wetsuits by the 2nd class. As a consequence of the large class size, we never learned anything about buoyancy control. Everyone was overweighted. It's no wonder you see so many vertical, overweighted divers plowing through the coral. I paid $450 for this class.

I think PPB should be combined with basic OW, even if it requires additional class, pool and open water dives. Perhaps it would be better if students started with a limited scuba diver card which required a DM or instructor and restricted their diving. They would be encouraged to actually dive in resort type situations where they can fall in love with diving and then move on to a higher-level OW and the less than ideal lake/cold/bad viz situations which often kills the desire of the newly minted diver. During the limited scuba experiences, the emphasis should be on bouyancy and trim, getting the kinks out of kicking, and proper gear selection. The local LDS could perhaps work out agreements with the tropical LDS in tandem training and commissions on gear sales to referred students. Whatever the method, the training should get the students motivated to learn to love diving which would create a diver for life and perhaps a customer for life as well.

 

[fpsndiver]

I personally wish that PADI, in particular, would spend less time on mindless specialties and making their instructors "pay another dollar in", and more time keeping up with the times.

I recall the days when PADI stance on dive computers was, "Don't use them, you are going to die."

I also recall when they held a similar stance on Nitrox....."Voodoo Gas, you are going to die."

Now, with the rising popularity of steel tanks, doubles, and technical diving.........or any decompression diving....their stance is still too conservative. I don't think that entry level divers ought to be doing deco diving, but even PADI's wreck-tech course is pretty conservative.

I don't know how NAUI, SSI, or others are fairing, but currently, I have become quite fond of IANTD and their progressive classes with no BS, and an honest assessment of the state of the sport.

 

[Scuba_Dooba_NJ]

The problem with your "absolute waiver" idea is that no waiver will stand up (nor should it) to an operator / manufacturer / instructor, whatever acting negligently . Now the individaul in question may or may not be negligent, but any perceived negligence would thereby bring a lawsuit, thereby bringing back the lawsuit overhead that is built in to "life support" products, thereby erasing the value of an "absolute waiver".

I laugh everytime I read a waiver that absolves the LDS / Dive Site / Boat of liability due to negligence.

I agree that a fully informed jury is important, but how many of us smart, savvy people do what we can to avoid jury duty?

A couple of points here...
Our UCLA friend still wants us all to shoulder the cost of litigation through "insurance" (translate "higher prices"), so at heart he's still a .... (fill in the blank)...
While the "loser pays" option looks good on the surface, that kind of policy breeds abuse in the real world. The real heart of our legal system's problems rests in the jury - our current system of easy outs, voir dire and limited, inaccurate instruction from judges with agendas virtually insures a jury of anything but your peers, and a verdict crafted by the ignorant and easily led.
If you haven't read it, I highly recommend the essays on our court system by Vin Suprynowicz in "Send in the Waco Killers."
VS is a rabid Libertarian and one must tolerate reading his opinions (unless, of course you agree) to get to the facts, but the facts are alarming. His idea of having a "fully informed jury" is the real solution to our litigation woes, for within it lies the ability to actually dispense justice - and mercy. A fully informed jury is the worst nightmare of a trial lawyer filing a frivolous lawsuit.
Rick

 

[TSandM]

Let's face it: Many of the problems everybody is describing are, at root, due to human stupidity, and there is no way to legislate or waive or even educate that away.

I've just learned to dive (and I was very lucky, because my OW class had a very high instructor/student ratio, spent time practicing and playing games in the pool, and had practice time in the OW dives as well). At the end of the OW cert, I was able to assemble my own gear and get it on, and survive a simple dive with someone else doing all the thinking. But I was smart enough to know that!

I also ride horses, and in that area, one also sees poorly educated and overconfident people making grievous errors that lead to injury. Just as with diving, most of those people don't want to hear anything from someone who sees the accident coming. Just as with diving (at least from what I am reading), a little time and money spent on better training would avoid many of the problems.

So I don't know what one could do to change the basic issues. Longer, more comprehensive OW courses might help, but would also drive away people who were unsure (as I was) of their commitment to the sport until they've actually had a chance to DO it. Provisional certification might help as well, but it would be my guess that the majority of really awful behavior/mistakes are made by people who don't WANT to be helped, just as in the horse world.

 

[Ocns_Spirit]

i agree with you TSandM! stupidity abounds..too bad there arent any regulations on that!!!

my LDS has three different schedules for those wanting to take the basic OW course: a weekend class, a week-long class, and a three week long class (2 nights a week for three weeks)....i have seen those instructors everyone dreads whose mantra is to teach the weekend class (which typically has the most people signed up--wanting their certification fast of course!) where the most money is to be made...i will never teach that weekend course b/c i believe it goes too fast and that for the average person it is hard to absorb all the information essential to diving safely in two and a half days! as an SSI instructor, i was taught in teaching my students that comfort comes through repetition. i firmly believe in that and so i tell my students that as their instructor, i will have them do any of the skills that we have already done as often and as random as i want to (also said with a sadistic giggle ;-D) and b/c i want my students to dive safely and love this sport as much as i do i tell them that just b/c the class is scheduled to be over does not mean that i will pass them in the skills department if any of them have any difficulties...but that i will work with them as often as need be: coming in early or arranging for extra days to play in the pool....

i realize that i'm only one instructor, but from what i've read here in the week that i've been a member, everyone has the same goal: diving safely and having fun doing it

 

[Walter]

Let's face it: Many of the problems everybody is describing are, at root, due to human stupidity, and there is no way to legislate or waive or even educate that away.

Of course, but this thread is: If you could change one thing about the dive industry, what would it be??

No one thinks these things will actually change, but in an ideal world.......

 

[rsdancey]

If I could change one thing about the recreational diving world, this is it:

Anything you're likely to remove or drop while diving should be positively bouyant and florescent colored. That means fins, gloves, flashlights, wrist-mounted dive computers, etc. I'd excuse dive knives (unless there's a postively bouyant ceramic blade I'm unaware of) and weights (for obvious reasons).

It drives me crazy that all this expensive gear I have is negatively bouyant. I can always surface to recover lost gear. I can't descend an infinite depth to recover something that sinks, and if vis is bad, something sunk on the bottom even at a skin-diving depth may be lost forever. And since so much of these items are black, they're hard to see.

In aggregate I'm not talking about pounds of B+; just a few ounces per item is all that would be required.

 

[Wayward Son]

I would remove the limits that big manufacturers place on dealers. Drop the authorized dealer requirement to get a warranty, and drop the minimum price structures. Let the shops compete with online dealers as they wish.

I can see requiring service to be done by an authorized dealer in order to keep your warranty, but not the sale.