How often do you need a 400ft primary reel?

[tbone1004]

@tmassey the fact that you are questioning these things is what is important. I don't know who your instructor is but I certainly disagree with calling a lost line drill complete without finding the line, properly tying into the line, and traversing until you reach the next arrow to validate direction of travel. I certainly would consider those things part of the skill...

As far as training and other gaps. As you said, you can't train for everything. The most important part of training is making sure that you can remain in the proper headspace to problem solve. Second most important part of training is to make sure that you have a solid understanding of the basics so that when you encounter an issue that is not part of the training that you can analyze the situation and properly apply that knowledge to the situation at hand.

I would consider things like a full lost line drill to be part of those basic skills for cave diving that you need to have nailed down to make sure that you can get out of a potentially more hairy situation.

 

[rddvet]

I guess at the end of the day it's the agency's fault because someone had to decide that it's not a required skill that has to be completed. At the same time, my good instructors always require beyond minimums skill accomplishment. It's definitely not a dig at your training, and as Tbone said, realizing the holes in your training is just as imoortant as perfecting a skill. Not all of my instructors were good. One class in particular was pretty crappy and I basically learned nothing I hadn't already been taught. Though that is also a testament to the instructor I had prior to that class. I quickly realized how much was skipped over in that class and was lucky enough to take other courses and had mentors that made up for it. I think that realizing I had a sh-t course and making sure I learned the things I felt were missed taught me more than any course could. So again I really didn't mean it as a dig on your training or skill as a cave diver. If you were to be a fly on the wall watching the one class I refer to you would assume I was a poorly trained diver. Luckily courses before and after made up for it.

 

[tbone1004]

@rddvet your CCR cave instructor was a bit sketchy though isn't he @kensuf

 

[rddvet]

@rddvet your CCR cave instructor was a bit sketchy though isn't he @kensuf

So sketchy that he watched me get completely tangled in cave line exiting Ginnie. All the while he and the other instructor just laughed at me (during the dive and for days later). I like to blame the idiots from the next level dive club blocking our exit and forcing me to turn around after loosening a tie off and getting all tangled up. But in reality it was really my own fault because I never should have been a helpful buddy and removed a tie off in the high flow of the ear and then even more stupidly do a 180 to look at my buddy because NLD club dummies were swarming us to video.
Oddly I had great instructors but none ever made me run a reel in the ear except for Ken 6 years after I got cave certified and was doing ccr crossover. So even with great instructors, there were things skipped that most other people are required to do in their classes. I'm not going to lie. I'm glad I got to skip that right of passage.

 

[Manatee Diver]

Oddly I had great instructors but none ever made me run a reel in the ear except for Ken 6 years after I got cave certified and was doing ccr crossover. So even with great instructors, there were things skipped that most other people are required to do in their classes. I'm not going to lie. I'm glad I got to skip that right of passage.

We always ran a reel in the ear, but always from just inside the ear. We never tied off in the chute, I've seen teams do that, it doesn't look like fun at all.

 

[rjack321]

I would get the 400ft. You can get into most caves without it but its not really any bigger size and for the occasional dive you will want the longer length

 

[1atm]

With the halcyon reel there is also a hole for the ocking screw on the front or back of the handle. I believe stock the screw is in the back. I like it up front, so I switched it around. My LM reels don't allow you to move the locking screw

my LM does have the holes front and back ... i guess it depends on the vintage (year) then

 

[rddvet]

my LM does have the holes front and back ... i guess it depends on the vintage (year) then

Mines the 200ft so maybe that’s the difference

 

[1atm]

@tmassey the fact that you are questioning these things is what is important. I don't know who your instructor is but I certainly disagree with calling a lost line drill complete without finding the line, properly tying into the line, and traversing until you reach the next arrow to validate direction of travel. I certainly would consider those things part of the skill...

@tmassey i would tend to agree with the above. The first time I did a lost line drill, I did find the line in what I thought was a reasonable amount of time (in real minutes it was a lot longer!). But in the process of tying into it, with some flow and what not, I managed to spin around. In the end I did exit in the correct direction, but there was a brief moment with a big learning experience. The excitement of “yay found line” Was quickly followed by a “damn, hang on, which way is out?”). I resolved it correctly, but imho it’s an important learning and should be part of the drill.

And come to think of it, that learning was repeated in my cave 2. I had gone off in the right direction, and through a combination of very bad luck, swam over the line. My buddies told me they were all mentally going “ooooooooooooohh” by how narrowly I missed. At some point I figured I must have gone too far, so turned around and found the line on the way back. That then caused a quick moment of re-orientation, because I had set off with the image “when I find the line, exit is to the left”, which it wasnt anymore on the way back. Again I took the correct decision, but a valuable learning experience.

 

[flymolo]

The H reel has the advantage over the LM that the top locking scew can't come out. I wouldn't have thought that was important until cave 1 .

The locking screw that won't come out seems innocuous until you lose the locking screw and your reel turns into a spinning ball of entanglement and death. +1 for halcyon over lm in this regard