How does Nitrox work?

[Puffer Fish]

In post #61, offthewall links us to the NOAA nitrox site... and I believe in that site, they pretty much sum up the issue:

"Why would you want to use nitrox?
In short, the correct nitrox mix can be safer than air for the diver."

They go on to talk about all the nitrox issues, but in the end...even he seems to agree with this.

 

[DaleC]

I just did a wreck charter (two dives @ 100 fsw).

Using air the NDL was 20 minutes (PADI tables). Cost $10/fill.
Using Nitrox I the NDL was 30 minutes (PADI tables). Cost $15/fill.

For an extra $5 I extended my bottom time by 50%.

Total cost of trip $200 or $100/dive.

5% of each dives cost extended the dive time by 50%.

That's another way that Nitrox works.

 

[offthewall1]

In post #61, offthewall links us to the NOAA nitrox site... and I believe in that site, they pretty much sum up the issue:

"Why would you want to use nitrox?
In short, the correct nitrox mix can be safer than air for the diver."

They go on to talk about all the nitrox issues, but in the end...even he seems to agree with this.

I have never once said I was against Nitrox use. Go back and read from the beginning. I have made all of the following points throughout this thread:

1. Nitrox is not for - or needed by everyone in recreational diving
2. Nitrox does have a place in recreational diving
3. Nitrox does have limitations and present potential danger
4. Nitrox should not be given to those who are uncertified in its use
5. No Gas - Nitrox or otherwise should be given unless requested - put this in reverse. How would you like it if you requested Nitrox and they gave you air? You'd be pissed right?
6. Businesses are not GOD... and have no right changing your gas mix. PERIOD.
7. Businesses that take this action should be reported as it is outside of every training and ethical standard in the industry

Some on this thread must surely be democrats. The whole idea that the Boat Captain or DM knows whats better for a diver than the diver himself - sounds alot like the idea we need big brother to tell us where to get our healthcare and how to spend our money.

Someone awhile back mentioned "personal responsibility." The person who wrongfully dispensed this fill is very lucky he didn't do it to me. I would have taken my personal responsibility and reported him directly to his agency, insurance company and RSTC.
Lucky for him what I have is a third party story... a story I believe and know happened, but I don't get too aggressive with those. I only report events in which I am personally present and see with my own eyes. Believe me, if this was reported, the consequenses would fall to my side of the argument - not the other.

 

[letterboy]

I have never once said I was against DIR use. Go back and read from the beginning. I have made all of the following points throughout this thread:

1. DIR is not for - or needed by everyone in recreational diving
2. DIR does have a place in recreational diving
3. DIR does have limitations and present potential danger
4. DIR should not be given to those who are uncertified in its use
5. No Gas - DIR or otherwise should be given unless requested - put this in reverse. How would you like it if you requested DIR and they gave you air? You'd be pissed right?
6. Businesses are not GOD... and have no right changing your gas mix. PERIOD.
7. Businesses that take this action should be reported as it is outside of every training and ethical standard in the industry

Is this a DIR thread?

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Some on this thread must surely be democrats.

Somehow I just KNEW that was gonna show up eventually ... it goes with the mindset.

Take it to The Pub ... this thread is to discuss nitrox, not your political views.

Someone awhile back mentioned "personal responsibility." The person who wrongfully dispensed this fill is very lucky he didn't do it to me. I would have taken my personal responsibility and reported him directly to his agency, insurance company and RSTC.

RSTC ???

You DO know the RSTC is primarily a marketing organization with no enforcement capability other than over its own member agencies?

You missed the point of personal responsibility altogether ... it has NOTHING to do with reporting people for doing things to you. It has EVERYTHING to do with taking control of your own dive ... or deciding not to do the dive if the circumstances make you uneasy.

Back in the day when Uncle Pug was teaching me all the things I never learned in a classroom he had a saying ... "You really need to rethink your approach to that dive." What it meant was that relying on others for your safety was unsafe ... blaming others for things that didn't go as you wanted them to was unsafe ... and the ONLY person responsible for your safety is you.

Reporting someone for a standards violation is legitimate ... blaming them because YOU made a decision to go ahead with a dive knowing that things weren't as you wanted them to be isn't. Only one person owns that responsibility and that is you.

Seriously ... the more I read your posts, the more convinced I become that you've missed the whole point of the safety issues you seem so concerned about.

You REALLY need to rethink your approach to that dive ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[offthewall1]

All I can say is fill my tanks with a mix other than what I ask for... and see what happens...

You're the ones missing the point

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

All I can say is fill my tanks with a mix other than what I ask for... and see what happens...

You're the ones missing the point

So what happens?

You analyze your own tanks.

Based on the results you either (a) accept the mix as appropriate for the dive, or (b) don't.

If you don't, then based on circumstances you either (a) ask the filler to redo the mix, or (b) decide not to use that tank for the dive (and possibly choose not to dive at all).

If it's an honest mistake you deal with it reasonably ... reasonable people make mistakes ... all humans do from time to time.

If it's a deliberate mistake, you can choose to report the person to their agency and you can choose not to do business with them again.

Other than that, any responses you might have in mind would either be (a) ineffective, (b) unreasonable, (c) irresponsible and/or (d) illegal.

You worry me, quite frankly ... and if I were in your area I would be counselinng potential students to stay far away from you. Not because I disagree with your views, but because, based on your posts you see everything in black and white ... right or wrong. Diving's way too situational to be taught that way ... all it produces is people who rely on a "checklist" mentality without ever developing an understanding of how situational every dive is, and how important it is to process what's going on around you in order to make an appropriate decision.

I've said this before in this thread ... it's not your opinion that most folks are finding objectionable. It's your attitude, and your "I'm right and those who oppose me are stupid" approach to any given issue. Diving's just not the right activity for people with that kind of attitude.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Teamcasa]

Someone awhile back mentioned "personal responsibility." The person who wrongfully dispensed this fill is very lucky he didn't do it to me. I would have taken my personal responsibility and reported him directly to his agency, insurance company and RSTC.

All I can say is fill my tanks with a mix other than what I ask for... and see what happens...

So what happens?

You analyze your own tanks.

Based on the results you either (a) accept the mix as appropriate for the dive, or (b) don't.

If you don't, then based on circumstances you either (a) ask the filler to redo the mix, or (b) decide not to use that tank for the dive (and possibly choose not to dive at all).

I said the same thing a few days ago, (post 82) are we really back to this argument again?

No. There is a problem and in a perfect world, your customer should have told them, "I'm not trained to dive Nitrox, please re-fill my tank.".

 

[hypertech]

I'm a relatively new diver (and only skimmed through a couple of the pages in this thread so maybe this was covered already).

When I dive nitrox, I feel better at the end of dive and I don't get quite as much dry mouth. My wife/dive buddy has observed the same. That's the main reason we are using it - its worth it to us just because of that alone.

 

[Diver0001]

Why not, if it works like that for you....