GUE Policy

[MechDiver]

roakey once bubbled...
As they ascended they did their 30, 20 and 10 foot stops horizontally mid-water without hanging on the anchor line, just like they had been taught to ascend in class.
Roak

This is great, but an openwater class was doing deco stops?

 

[Lawman]

Like so many of the threads on the board we always seem to wind up with instructors bemoaning the poor quality training that they see in the industry. This is probably true. Still, the point I'm trying to make is that diving is an industry. It's selling products whether training, equiptment, or travel. For that industry to thrive it takes customers. There is no reason that there can't be plenty of people diving at all ages. From SCUBA Rangers to people like me. Our training doesn't uniformly have to be at the highest levels because diving isn't uniformly dangerous. It ranges from pool to TEC. I think the training shoud be aimed at the individual and his or her diving plans. Don't deck me out in a bunch of cave diving crap because I'm not going to cave dive. Ever. Give me a good and fast refresher course before Coz instead.
We've got too much ego tied up in this The Few, The Proud, The Divers stuff. If you want to limit diving to the people that can afford the training time of DIR and the physical demands of GUE than wait a few years: you won't be diving anymore.:doctor:

 

[MHK]

MechDiver once bubbled...


This is great, but an openwater class was doing deco stops?

Yes,

We teach our students that rather then doing 3 minutes at 15' that it's more efficient to do 1 minute stops at 30' 20' & 10'..

Hope that clears it up..

Later

 

[roakey]

MechDiver once bubbled...
This is great, but an openwater class was doing deco stops?

Did I say deco stops? No I didn't.

They were safety stops and buoyancy control practice (mostly practice, since they didn't go very deep since they were their training dives). If any of them ever do go technical, deco will be a breeze.

Roak

 

[wb416]

MechDiver once bubbled...


This is great, but an openwater class was doing deco stops?

I don't think one has to be doing deco stops to practice and exhibit buoyancy control.

I'm sure it helps the bubble growth too since we all know that all dives are decompression dives!

HTH, wb

 

[Aquamaniac]

roakey once bubbled...
You don’t have to wait for DIRF to learn DIR principles. There was an intern that helped with the DIRF class in New Mexico that teaches diving in San Diego. He’s not a GUE instructor yet, but is in training. So currently he’s training under the aegis of one of the major agencies, but is “raising the bar” for those classes.

Roak

Great point Roak.

I sadly am unable to do a DIRF class at present. I have however read the book cover to cover, a few times over, actually its still sitting on my desk right now.

I learnt alot from just reading, not enought to say I am a DIR diver, but enough to get my gear to a point that is safer than it was before, and my mind thinking about how to approach diving.
I dont have the skills or experience to be a DIR diver, but I have the platform for when I am ready to learn, not perfect, but better than nothing.

dave

 

[wb416]

Aquamaniac once bubbled...



I learnt alot from just reading, not enought to say I am a DIR diver, but enough to get my gear to a point that is safer than it was before, and my mind thinking about how to approach diving.
I dont have the skills or experience to be a DIR diver, but I have the platform for when I am ready to learn, not perfect, but better than nothing.

dave

I would recommend that you and your buddy watch these video clips, then practice and critique each other. It's not a substitute for a hands-on instructor, but you and your buddy can compare what you're seeing in each other and help each other. Your eventual command of these skills may surprise you. Of course there is a downside.... Practice makes Permanent, so bad habits will be practiced and incorporated also, unless your buddy is paying close attention and points them out.

http://www.fifthd.com/divestore/classes/dirrec.html

 

[Aquamaniac]

Thanks for the link cwb.

All over them like a rash, have been for some time now.

 

[wb416]

Aquamaniac once bubbled...

All over them like a rash, have been for some time now.

If it's a rash you have, then maybe the ointment you need for that itch is a Fundies class!

 

[cmay]

MHK once bubbled...


CMAY,

I don't want to sound as though I'm parsing words but I'd like to try to draw a distinction in your post about the issue of standards vis-a-vis the enforcement of such standards..

In my view, standards are so easily manipulated as to be laughable and there are a few organizations out there that have done such an effective job at writing standards that shift the burden of responsibility from the training organization onto the shoulders of the instructor that it invites closer inspection. The language about * in the opinion of the instructor* isn't there by accident. It's there because if somethimg happens the the whole notion of *putting the system on trial and not the instructor* stays bullet proof because the simple response from the agency is going to be * that in 'the opinion of this particular instructor'..*.. In other words, it's a duplicity that protects the organization and shifts teh burden of responsibility off the agency and on to you..

So on the surface most agencies have the RSTC standards at it's core so the standards aren't an issue, per se.. However, what is important in my view, is the willingness of agencies to promote events such as follows:

http://www.saintbrendan.com/cdnjan02/news1.html

The idea of earning 7 specialties over a weekend simply speaks to a willingness to lower the bar to the lowest common denominator not force it's members to raise the bar.. Once a culture of mediocrity is accepted it's twice as hard to regain the idea of increasing levels of achievement and that is what caused me to re-think my rating at PADI.. I walked out of my PADI IDC 8 years ago when the told me that I needed to promote continuing education 3 times each module, in the opening, during the body and the close.. So I asked why??? And they said it was worth 20% of the grade during the IE and it stared me thinking that a for-profit agency, that has it's corportae mission to increase profit and increase market share, that self-policies itself is to vulnerable to conflicts of interest for my taste...

In my view, the coprporate culture starts at the top and works it's way down and the standards are too easy to *manipulate* to lay it all off on S & P's..

But again, that's just my 2 cents..

Later

Points well taken, MHK.

I would like to say that I am in no way an outspoken advocate of PADI. Actually, I am far from it. I do not like their business practices, but I do like the fact that they have opened diving up to the masses. I feel that at the core, the basic and simple RSTC skills and standards are a good thing. All I am saying is that most of the problems with recreational scuba can be solved with "tweaking" the existing standards, policies, and procedures. I just do not feel that a "grass roots movement" needs to be started.

Thanks for the link. I agree, that is just ridiculous. It is an example of when PADI needs to step in and say " whoaaa guys, are you f@#$in' nuts? You're not putting our name on that!" Sorry, that's more on the business practices. I'll save that for another post.