GUE JJ configuration

[211ratsbud]

There are good alternatives to Lolas or even flexible hoses.

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Where did you buy the nautec? I do like the way those look and fit .

 

[Wibble]

There are good alternatives to Lolas or even flexible hoses.

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Reaching the valves is part of the pre-dive sequence, so you should "train" it with every dive ;-)
Yes, it is harder than with a "normal" double, but it is doable.

Does this show that the flexible HP manifold hose cannot be removed without tools?

It does raise the question of how the Diluent/Bailout cylinders are changed when there's a soft manifold. It looks a complex job where the new cylinders need to be handled very gently, not something to do on a rolling boat. Any water droplets in that HP hose or the valves would be quickly pushed into the cylinders; needs a good blow through.

Compare with a normal CCR configuration which uses a single 3 litre diluent cylinder that is very easily swapped over in seconds. Any water on the valve simply cannot enter the cylinder; it gets pushed into the first stage. Similarly changing bailout is a matter of choosing the correct cylinders for the dive profile (which is the same as when using backmounted dil/out as that gas cannot be used for the whole bailout except for a trivial shallow dive).

 

[211ratsbud]

Does this show that the flexible HP manifold hose cannot be removed without tools?

It does raise the question of how the Diluent/Bailout cylinders are changed when there's a soft manifold. It looks a complex job where the new cylinders need to be handled very gently, not something to do on a rolling boat. Any water droplets in that HP hose or the valves would be quickly pushed into the cylinders; needs a good blow through.

Compare with a normal CCR configuration which uses a single 3 litre diluent cylinder that is very easily swapped over in seconds. Any water on the valve simply cannot enter the cylinder; it gets pushed into the first stage. Similarly changing bailout is a matter of choosing the correct cylinders for the dive profile (which is the same as when using backmounted dil/out as that gas cannot be used for the whole bailout except for a trivial shallow dive).

I run a charter op. I've never seen this be an issue and if you ask the guys diving in the Atlantic off of Jersey I'm 100% certain it's not an issue either. Most guys either have enough dilout for a few dives or have a whip bottle.

 

[RedSix]

The hp hose in this setup shown on the picture is not flexible. It is a rigid pipe with Swagelok connectors.

If you use a flexible hose instead of the rigid pipe you can detach the bottles and replace them without the need for tools. But all flexible hoses I know off are do leak He. But actually this isn't an issue, since you can close both isolators and only the He in the hose drains.

Actually I don't see a reason to change the bottles, especially on a boat. With 14L you can do plenty dives before you need to refill the bottles.

 

[RedSix]

Where did you buy the nautec? I do like the way those look and fit .

Altough i am from Germany, i bought these in the UK. I don't know where to get them atm. Nautec didn't answer my mail at all ;-)

 

[RedSix]

Altough i am from Germany, i bought these in the UK. I don't know where to get them atm. Nautec didn't answer my mail at all ;-)

Looks like it is now possible to buy it directly at Nautec:

Explorer Valves Archive | NAUTEC

dive-nautec.de

You can even buy it without the flex hose and use Swagelok instead:

"For GUE-Divers, who are looking for an alternative configuration, we offer the valves without the elbows and the hose. A female G1/4” outlet on each valve, enables the attachment of a variety of SwageLock fitting options."

 

[PfcAJ]

Yes... of course not everyone diving one of those rigs can actually reach the valves, which are harder to get to than the valves on a manifolded twinset. As GUE diver said to me "You only have to reach them during the course".

Does anyone know how long you've got before you lose all your gas if a LOLA manifold ruptures? I know that with a normal HP hose you've got ages but obviously the manifold has a much larger bore. Has anyone tested it?

Turns out you need to be able to reach your valves in any configuration.

Double with an extended manifold like the Lola have been used for like 20+ years in very demanding environments. Its not causing any problems.

 

[rddvet]

Yes... of course not everyone diving one of those rigs can actually reach the valves, which are harder to get to than the valves on a manifolded twinset. As GUE diver said to me "You only have to reach them during the course".

Does anyone know how long you've got before you lose all your gas if a LOLA manifold ruptures? I know that with a normal HP hose you've got ages but obviously the manifold has a much larger bore. Has anyone tested it?

If someone can’t reach their Lola valves they should not be diving that unit then. Only touching the valves in class is bs. It should be part of every predive plan as well as done anytime there could have been contact with the valves. Although gue divers believe in team diving, team diving doesn’t mean I don’t have to be able to touch my valves cause I have a buddy to do it. If you can’t shut down valves in any configuration, you’re a liability to your teammate. I will say that closing the oxygen valve with the gue JJ style setup can be challenging. Lola valves no. That means your setup isn’t properly set up for you. Many things to fix that such as moving tanks up or down or harness adjustments.

 

[Wibble]

If someone can’t reach their Lola valves they should not be diving that unit then. Only touching the valves in class is bs. It should be part of every predive plan as well as done anytime there could have been contact with the valves. Although gue divers believe in team diving, team diving doesn’t mean I don’t have to be able to touch my valves cause I have a buddy to do it. If you can’t shut down valves in any configuration, you’re a liability to your teammate. I will say that closing the oxygen valve with the gue JJ style setup can be challenging. Lola valves no. That means your setup isn’t properly set up for you. Many things to fix that such as moving tanks up or down or harness adjustments.

Don't you dive with the manifold closed and only opened if you need to access the gas on "the other side"?

 

[rddvet]

Don't you dive with the manifold closed and only opened if you need to access the gas on "the other side"?

Who the f does that? I definitely do not. Its just like doubles. Isolator(s) and valves open just like doubles. Only time the isolator and valves all remain shut is when the unit isn't being dove to avoid helium leakage from the lola crossover (which is a nonissue if you keep them closed).
I'm not gue ccr trained. I have gue training but I dive a fathom rebreather with both sm and bm bailout configurations. As far as I know there are no gue instructors teaching jj divers to keep one side closed. It makes zero sense and I would be shocked and saddened if that's taught.