General Vortex Incident Discussion

[spector39]

...
As for the restrictions, on the above map, Champagne Bottleneck is the 3rd restriction and the end of the mapped cave (far left) is the 4th restriction. Although I wouldn't even call the 1st 2 restrictions restrictions...

The pic of the map posted above is blury and it's hard to read the text. How does it relate to the other map? IE, does this one start where the other one leaves off?

 

[Dive-aholic]

A hole in the boxes won't help. It takes almost an entire AL80 to fill 1 box at Vortex.


The Champagne Bottleneck is the area where the passage turns down in the blurry map. The blurry map shows the cave from the entrance. The online map stops right after the gate.

 

[Rick Murchison]

There is an air pocket in one of the Maui wrecks. The smart diver purges a reg some to make sure there is enough O2. At +3 ATM there does not have to be much O2 for it to be enough for a few breaths.

Oxygen in the talk boxes is not of concern. Carbon Dioxide is.
Rick

 

[Hetland]

Oxygen in the talk boxes is not of concern. Carbon Dioxide is.
Rick

I thought I read that two snorkelers suffered expansion injuries years ago, because they swam down, talked for a minute, and then made an ascent without venting.

The box in the basin is certainly shallow enough to invite repeat occurrences. An accident waiting to happen if you ask me.

 

[bleeb]

Oxygen in the talk boxes is not of concern. Carbon Dioxide is.

I'm not promoting it as a safe practice, but if the number of people sticking their head in a volume is low (a few per day, and for relatively short periods), the CO2 may be almost completely dissolved in the underlying water and be washed away. This might contribute to why enough people get away with it often enough that some don't realize the dangers.

alert

Just out of interest, if the figures I dug up are correct, in a cubical volume with the bottom open, if there's enough CO2 to make it feel a bit stuffy, it should then take about six hours for most of it to wash away. If you're looking at a volume that's lower and flatter in aspect ratio, the clearance time drops correspondingly. To build up that much CO2 in a cubic meter only takes roughly 20 person-minutes, so a couple of people in a head-tall space would take only a few minutes to become a problem, especially for the person following them. And of course you wouldn't know how long ago the space was occupied and for how long.

 

[LastMate]

It’s been some time since I’ve posted to or checked out SB. Since then a lot has changed in my diving world. Going from a cocky smart ass OW diver thinking that I could do whatever I wanted with diving to a better smarter and further trained IDC Staff instructor. This very unfortunate incident has even rattled divers as far north as Alaska. I’m currently training with a GUE instructor here in Anchorage and have found out the hard way of how bad a diver I really was. And training for environments like this should not be taken lightly. Let’s face it folks cave is NOT for everyone. Now with regard to this subject matter I’m not saying anything about the person involved, his skills or knowledge, or anything of the sort. It’s a very simple blunt statement of "If you don’t have the training and don’t have the experience then DONT DO THE DIVE" I’m slapping myself for this from my past and knowing how really stupid I was. To those folks who read this that have the training and experience my hats off to you. Maybe someday I can almost be as good as you all in diving. For my OW students and other divers not trained in cave. This should be a good wake up call for you thinking that overhead environments and diving alone is ok to do. BE SAFE AND SMART OUT THERE! KNOW YOUR LIMITS! AND DIVE WITH A BUDDY! A lot of simple mistakes and incidents I see are things covered in even a basic Open Water class. Diving requires a certification for a reason. As does all its SEPARATE and far advanced entities that go along with it. To wrap this up my thoughts and prayers go out to the families of our lost fellow dive brother. Again you all stay safe out there!

 

[sabbath999]

No problem...those nifty tank boots (not often seen on SM) will keep them from damaging any cave....not that they seem to be worried about it......

Yeah, I can remember the look Edd gave the boots on my LP 120's when I brought them in for a fill. It was a look of "what are those disgusting things doing on perfectly good tanks"...

I guess I should say the boots that were FORMERLY on my 120's... hey, at least I have an excuse, they were on the tanks when I bought them used

 

[diver 85]

LastMate, exactly what 'problems' have you straightened since becoming a "smarter and further trained IDC Staff instructor"......

 

[cruiser]

Yeah, I can remember the look Edd gave the boots on my LP 120's when I brought them in for a fill. It was a look of "what are those disgusting things doing on perfectly good tanks"...

I guess I should say the boots that were FORMERLY on my 120's... hey, at least I have an excuse, they were on the tanks when I bought them used

I just had boots taken off my tanks. Never did figure out what they're for. They catch on things when sliding my tanks out of the car, and encourage deterioration.

 

[sabbath999]

Nice thing about where I dive is that if I'm down there more than a few days, the recovery isn't necessary ... unless ya just want the gear ... the crabs and starfish will have taken care of the rest.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Well... so what if we want the gear