Fundamentals 1 & 2?

[VR78]

a GUE Instructor can crank your stress level on one dive easy.....

True dat.
However the total immersion component would be lost I think.

 

[KevinNM]

The drawback is that you don't have a lot of time to practice the skills you get shown at the start, so if you can't do them the stuff being added on isn't going to work too well either. Over a few months I spent 20 hours or so in the pool and 10+ in deep water working on techniques between primer and fundamentals. Eventually the backkick just clicked and I started going back instead of back and up. I'm still seeing issues with things like doing 10m/min ascent rates and being able to stop where I want, as I can't get the suit and wing to be properly vented fast enough, but things are much better.

 

[VR78]

Over a few months I spent 20 hours or so in the pool and 10+ in deep water working on techniques between primer and fundamentals. Eventually the backkick just clicked and I started going back instead of back and up.

Hold on, the Fundies were designed to EITHER teach you the backkick etc etc etc OR to test your proficiency in these skills so that you could progress to T1/C1. There was really no requirement for having the skills mastered prior to class. I came into Fundies without ever having done five inches in reverse...

 

[KevinNM]

Hold on, the Fundies were designed to EITHER teach you the backkick etc etc etc OR to test your proficiency in these skills so that you could progress to T1/C1. There was really no requirement for having the skills mastered prior to class. I came into Fundies without ever having done five inches in reverse...

Sure, but I did primer to understand what I was supposed to be able to do. Backkick was one of the things that just didn't work under water, until suddenly it did (usually...). It's a bit less stressful if you are refining what you know rather then trying to both learn and master new skills in few days, while the instructors thrown more stuff at you to increase task loading.

 

[Bak]

It's an endless debate... some people like to train BEFORE (and AFTER) GUE courses...some don't...some people are fast learner some are not...I'm one of those...but I do love to train....

 

[bradells]

If you would have asked me this before we started Fundies 1, I would have said "yes", emphatically. And change from wetsuit to drysuit. Last night after our 2nd pool session, we were just about to ready to run over all our dive gear with the truck. This morning, we're back to a "yes" and still aim to do it in a drysuit. The difference is that we most likely need more dives and practice between the two than we'd originally thought.

Nearly everyone feels the same way during the course. The instructors won't put too much pressure on you that you go 'full retard', but add on enough to make you really work at a skill, task loading, or just try to do nothing and 'stay' in one place.

Keep at it, your skills, awareness and awesomeness will go up many notches/levels if you keep at it and finish the course irregardless of the grade outcome.

My next GUE course after Fundies was much easier and fun, with a lot more task loading (DPV1).



BRad

 

[C Dub]

Based on my experience with Fundies - taken a month ago as one chunk over 4.5 days - I must say I do disagree. This was a boot camp sort of training and as such it certainly benefited from a certain consistent and prolonged stress and pressure. It was a lot of fun, too. I don't think I would have succeeded had this class been split into more "manageable" chunks as the entire atmosphere and approach would feel more relaxed and less demanding. To me, the stress level was the key to success. I must say though that taking the class some place far away from home/work/family/internet access etc. helped a lot.

Classes generally went from 8 am to 8 pm, and looking at my log I see that we've made nine pool dives lasting from 15 to 50 min and five OW dives at around 15-25 min each. Total time in the water was six hours. My buddy dived a single tank rig and received a Rec pass, and I aimed for and received a Tech pass. To me, the team work aspects of the class were the biggest challenge.

I note for emphasis that you went for, and got, a Tec Pass. This implies that you were already familiar with drysuit, doubles, and likely had a better grasp of propulsion trim and buoyancy that a typical PADI diver has coming into fundies. In my experience many (most?) PADI instructors with thousands of dives don't get a Tec pass after the first 4 days. My point is that I think your experience was rather unusual.

I'd love to hear from GUE instructors their point of view on this....

 

[KevinNM]

My next GUE course after Fundies was much easier and fun, with a lot more task loading (DPV1).

I heard that was a lot of fun. Though the instructor said this was not necessarily true for the instructor....

 

[johnkendall]

I note for emphasis that you went for, and got, a Tec Pass. This implies that you were already familiar with drysuit, doubles, and likely had a better grasp of propulsion trim and buoyancy that a typical PADI diver has coming into fundies. In my experience many (most?) PADI instructors with thousands of dives don't get a Tec pass after the first 4 days. My point is that I think your experience was rather unusual.

I'd love to hear from GUE instructors their point of view on this....

For me (as a GUE Instructor) I don't really care which type of pass someone is aiming for. Everyone who comes on one of my classes gets improved as far as they can within the 4 days.

What I don't like though is students coming to the class having practiced anything other than just breathing underwater. My job is to teach how to do buoyancy, trim and propulsion. The better someone is coming in, the further I can push them, but that's it. I've had people pass the class who have come in with very few dives, I've had people not pass with lots. Mostly it comes down to attitude, and whether the person is prepared to do what I tell them.

If you've never dived a drysuit prior to the class, you would struggle to get a Tech pass though. This is where the Drysuit primer can be a very useful tool.

Regarding the split format vs full class. I personally have run a couple of split classes and didn't think that they worked as well as the full class. However I believe that the flexibility can be useful, particularly for those people who struggle to get time off work for the class.

Regards
John

 

[VR78]

This implies that you were already familiar with drysuit, doubles, and likely had a better grasp of propulsion trim and buoyancy that a typical PADI diver has coming into fundies.

I had very, very good luck with my SDI OW instructor as the core skills have been worked on from my day 1 in confined water. I also took the TDI Intro to Tech class right after my AOW but in all fairness the only thing I really learned was how to put the rig together.

Where in SoCal are you?