Fire on safari boat Suzana in Egypt (Red Sea Aggressor)
- Thread starter Miyaru
- Start date
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Mike Walker
Contributor
Exactly.
I want to pay 20% more for everything in my life and receive 20% more value in return. But apparently that is not allowed in the modern economy.
Everything is either cheap crap or overpriced faux luxury. True quality at a reasonable premium almost does not exist and we've gotten to the point where the bean counters have run out of places to cut corners that aren't safety related.
Ministryofgiraffes
Contributor
You can guarantee the ‘cheap crap’ will have a ‘totally mesmerizing 10/10’ review on liveaboard.com
Ministryofgiraffes
Contributor
But seriously. Surprised not to see the elide ball on liveaboards. I’ve been asking all last/this year and it’s always met with a confused ‘a what’ ?
It’s a pretty simple solution IMO.
It’s a pretty simple solution IMO.
I'm curious as to how well this product stands up to testing (and if applicable, real world instances where it was deployed).
Mike Walker
Contributor
On paper it does look great....
For $160CAD on Amazon and an apparent 5 year lifespan it seems worth a try whether it works or not.
Interestingly one can buy the knock off version for $29.49CAD.
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My day job is in toxicology. Pretty much every flame retardant used in furnishings is nasty. There are flame retardants in computers, TVs, couches, mattresses, cell phones, dust, dogs, cats, seagulls, seals, whales, mothers, fathers, and babies. From the Arctic to the Antarctic. They can and often actually demonstrably cause immunosuppression, neurological disfunction, endocrine disruption, low sperm counts, low birth weights, cancer, the list of known and suspected impacts goes on and on.
We will be "cleaning" up from the legacy of chlorinated, brominated, fluoridated, and phosphate flame retardants for eons. Accidents and fires on boats and in homes are bad yes. Slathering on flame retardants in an effort to prevent or slow down fires on inherently combustible materials isn't necessarily better.
Anthias
Registered
Hi
I've been following all this, but trying to get work done as well! Part of that has been contacting boats I book and asking about egress from the lower decks, fire alarms, charging, nightwatches, regulations, all safety stuff. With the big DEMA show happening right now, some replies are slow, but I am getting replies. These are moderate to higher end boats, and so far, so good. I can share more if folks want, but I will be slow as I also have to work.
However, I have a cautionary tale for all following this thread. You get what you pay for.
I have a client that likes to be....thrifty. He wanted me to book him on a boat in Indonesia. I knew nothing about this boat and it had no website. No website means they don't even have the presence or support staff to do that much. He'd found it on Liveaboard.com. I couldn't get any of the information I consider vital before booking any dive operator, so I told him I would not book it for him as I didn't think it would be safe. I also advised against Liveaboard.com, as I've read poor reviews about their support and follow through. So he booked it instead on PADI.com. I refused to have anything to do with the booking because I didn't think it was safe and I told him that. I want to know the layout of a boat, if they have two engines, two compressors, emergency oxygen, life rafts, etc.
After his trip, he sent a link to a video of their trip. The boat is a wooden phinisi, which are immensely popular these days for their ambiance. At one point, it shows a woman coming up a vertical wooden ladder, out of a small square hatch, to the main deck. Vertical, quite small, all of it wood. I just wrote him and asked if that was the main way out of the lower deck where all the cabins were. Not only was it the main way, it was the only way. I can post a link to the video if you want to see it.
This boat is advertised and sold on major booking websites. There is no way to find out anything like this before you book because these booking agencies don't know. They are just the middlemen to sell stuff.
We can talk all we want about boats doing it this way and that way and redoing this and that. And I will push for all these things. But as long as there are divers that want to get it cheap, and use booking sites like this that will sell these boats, we are going to have boats like this out there. Neither of these fires where on fly by night boats. They both had great reputations and had been in operation for years. There are over a hundred boats in Raja Ampat alone. I know and have detailed information on around 20. From talking with people I know that live in Indonesia and have no connection to any specific boat, I've been told that many of these are locally owned, operated, and sit in port a great deal waiting for customers. But they are sold on these websites that you should be able to trust.
I, as an agency, can only do so much. All of you, as buyers, need to be aware. Ask questions! And if you can't get the answers, is supporting that boat worth saving the $?
I've been following all this, but trying to get work done as well! Part of that has been contacting boats I book and asking about egress from the lower decks, fire alarms, charging, nightwatches, regulations, all safety stuff. With the big DEMA show happening right now, some replies are slow, but I am getting replies. These are moderate to higher end boats, and so far, so good. I can share more if folks want, but I will be slow as I also have to work.
However, I have a cautionary tale for all following this thread. You get what you pay for.
I have a client that likes to be....thrifty. He wanted me to book him on a boat in Indonesia. I knew nothing about this boat and it had no website. No website means they don't even have the presence or support staff to do that much. He'd found it on Liveaboard.com. I couldn't get any of the information I consider vital before booking any dive operator, so I told him I would not book it for him as I didn't think it would be safe. I also advised against Liveaboard.com, as I've read poor reviews about their support and follow through. So he booked it instead on PADI.com. I refused to have anything to do with the booking because I didn't think it was safe and I told him that. I want to know the layout of a boat, if they have two engines, two compressors, emergency oxygen, life rafts, etc.
After his trip, he sent a link to a video of their trip. The boat is a wooden phinisi, which are immensely popular these days for their ambiance. At one point, it shows a woman coming up a vertical wooden ladder, out of a small square hatch, to the main deck. Vertical, quite small, all of it wood. I just wrote him and asked if that was the main way out of the lower deck where all the cabins were. Not only was it the main way, it was the only way. I can post a link to the video if you want to see it.
This boat is advertised and sold on major booking websites. There is no way to find out anything like this before you book because these booking agencies don't know. They are just the middlemen to sell stuff.
We can talk all we want about boats doing it this way and that way and redoing this and that. And I will push for all these things. But as long as there are divers that want to get it cheap, and use booking sites like this that will sell these boats, we are going to have boats like this out there. Neither of these fires where on fly by night boats. They both had great reputations and had been in operation for years. There are over a hundred boats in Raja Ampat alone. I know and have detailed information on around 20. From talking with people I know that live in Indonesia and have no connection to any specific boat, I've been told that many of these are locally owned, operated, and sit in port a great deal waiting for customers. But they are sold on these websites that you should be able to trust.
I, as an agency, can only do so much. All of you, as buyers, need to be aware. Ask questions! And if you can't get the answers, is supporting that boat worth saving the $?
Mike Walker
Contributor
KevinNM
Contributor
I remember someone on their site mentioned people who had their rebreather catch fire. While they were using it, underwater. I don't think it ended well. 100% O2 is fun stuff.
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