Fatalities statistics: what kills people the most in scuba diving?

[boulderjohn]

How could they possibly know whether the victims was being stressed by something preventable before death?

flots.

Why don't you go to any of the recent DAN fatality reports and read them? It's usually pretty clear. Believe it or not, in most cases people saw what happened and reported it.
There was a case just last year (not in the DAN report yet--reported here on SB) in which two divers were poking in the sediment looking for shark teeth. One of them suddenly made a funny noise and stopped moving. He was dead. The autopsy showed a heart attack. Wouldn't you say that was pretty clear?

People don't just have heart attacks because they are enduring some kind of highly stressful case. In fact, that is usually not the case. Most heart attacks happen during sleep.

 

[flots am]

Why don't you go to any of the recent DAN fatality reports and read them?

I had, which was why your comment fascinated me.

flots.

 

[boulderjohn]

I had, which was why your comment fascinated me.

flots.

Now I'm confused. I have read every description of every incident for the past 4-5 years, and in all the cases in which they determined that the cause of death was a cardiac event, I thought it was pretty darned obvious that the cause was a cardiac event unrelated to anything in the dive. The only exceptions I can recall are the very few that occurred on the surface with the diver fighting a current.

You seem to think that it is impossible to have a heart attack unless that heart attack is preceded by some sort of panic-inducing stress. In the case I described above, can you describe what you think may have peen the panic-inducing event that led up to the heart attack?

 

[Kevrumbo]

[/Bump] Some past dive accident stats, from Catalina Hyperbaric Volunteer Chamber Crew Program Class of Oct 6-8 2006:

Initial Reported or Observed Problem of Divers Brought to the Catalina Hyperbaric Chamber (1995 - 2000):

Buoyancy Problem: 12%
Air Supply Problem: 11%
Buddy Problems: 10%
Decompression Problem: 6%
Equalizing Problem: 6%
Pain: 6%
Uncomfortable: 5%
Environmental Problem: 4%
Equipment Problem: 3%
Medical Problem: 3%
Regulator Problem: 3%
Rapid Ascent: 2%
Fatigue: 2%
Rebreather Problem: 2%
Mask Problem: 2%
Aspiration (water): 1%
Panic: 1%
No Problems Noted: approx. 10% occurrence

Quote: Divers Brought to the Catalina Chamber
--Did They Panic During the Dive?
Panicked: 33%
Did not Panic: 42%
Unknown: 25%

Quote: Divers Brought to the Catalina Chamber and
Suffering From AGE/Drowning/Near Drowning
--Did They Panic During the Dive?
Panicked: 51%
Did not Panic: 19%
Unknown: 30%

Quote:Cases from 1995 thru 2000
Of 154 Divers Brought to the Chamber:
76 (49%) Recompressed:
43 (57%) of which were DCS related
33 (43%) of which were Air Embolism related

78 (51%) Not Recompressed:
23 (29%) Rule Out AGE
23 (29%) Rule Out DCS
19 (24%) Near Drowning
9 (12%) Drowning
4 (5%) AGE/DCS Refused Treatment Against Medical Advice

19 (12%) Full Arrest --Fatalities

​

 

[flots am]

can you describe what you think may have peen the panic-inducing event that led up to the heart attack?

A number from 2008 specifically mention panic or extreme stress. If I cared enough, I'd go back and copy and paste from the reports, but I don't.

Have a nice night.

flots.

 

[boulderjohn]

A number from 2008 specifically mention panic or extreme stress. I cared enough, I'd go back and copy and paste from the reports, but I don't.

Have a nice night.

flots.

Oh, there is no question that there was panic involved in a number of deaths. That is well known. A number of deaths are caused by embolisms preceded by panicked ascents to the surface. Those are not generally listed as cardiac deaths, though. Your assertion was that panic must have preceded the cardiac deaths as well.

 

[Hatul]

Ken,

It took me a few more days to get back to this thread, and I apologize for the delay. This is a report on a scuba fatality that I investigated in 1987. I identified a number of contributing factors:

Contributing Factors

1. The diver was over-weighted on this dive, carrying a 20 pound weight belt in addition to 49 pounds in a Seapro At-pak.
2. Possible regulator malfunction--first stage. (A leak was found upon inspection of the gear.)
3. Possible regulator malfunction--second stage. (The regulator was missing the exhaust tee, which could have allowed water seepage into the second stage housing. This, along with the high suction pressure, could have allowed sea water to enter the diver's lungs in the form of a fine mist.)
4. Regulator malfunction--second stage. (Breathing resistance was measured to be very high.)
5. His BC would not hold air.
6. With gloves, it would be difficult to dump gear, including weights because he could not feel the Velcro-lined nylon on the vest.
7. Diving alone...no one in the water at the bottom to help him.
8. Out-of-air situation, most probably while underwater. This precluded him from inflating his BC (which leaked) or his dry suit.

These combination of factors came together to cause this fatality. Which one, under DAN's "trigger" theory started the sequence of events? I don't think any one of them alone was a trigger, but under current accident theory they all contributed to overwhelm the diver and cause the fatality. I'll get further into some of the accident theory later.



John C. Ratliff, CSP, CIH, MSPH

With so many serious issues I'm wondering if he deliberately set things up to kill himself?

 

[j2s]

Complacency, ego, indifference, bravado, ignorance, they all start the 'domino effect' rolling........

 

[John C. Ratliff]

I got away from this thread for a while, and did not realize the turn it took. As an industrial hygienist, I must add a bit of perspective on the heart attack while diving issue--it can be tied with CO (carbon monoxide) in the breathing air under pressure. I know of one heart attack while diving which was attributed to CO in the breathing air; it occurred in either the Seattle area or Vancouver BC, but happened to an Oregon diver. I do not now have the specifics, but a person does not need to be under a "panic" situation while diving to have a heart attack. Diving itself induces several stressors, including breathing air under pressure, cold, possible equipment restrictions to movement, etc. These stresses, and potentially breathing CO under pressure where the partial pressure causes it to be a potential toxin (by excluding oxygen from the RBCs) could trigger a heart attack.

SeaRat
John C. Ratliff, CSP, CIH, MSPH

 

[ScubaPink]

violent water movement.

I learned alot reading all this. (that alot of this is way over my head. lol) What I did not see anyone talk about was "violent water movement." What could this be and how could it cause death? damage your equipment? current would be steady and not fast changing?