Eel Attack in Cozumel (The Feeding of Lionfish)

[MMM]

What should be done with the lionfish? When I shoot them (which is always outside of the park) I just make sure they are dead and set them free. Something will eat them eventually (us, if they are big enough). The op I dive with does the same inside the park. Sometimes they aren't entirely dead when he sets them free. I think that the DMs here in Coz make an assessment of the divers in their group before deciding whether or not to kill lionfish. If the divers look incompetent to shakey, then they watch the divers closer than the lionfish. Conversely, if the divers look competent, they can feel more confident in knocking off a few lionfish. I don't mind. I can always find other things to look at in the vicinity when lionfish are being targetted by the DM.

 

[TSandM]

It is potentially dangerous maybe, but more to the point for ME when I'm diving, it's BORING. I don't care how great you are with your spear, just get on with the dive. Of any of the numerous things I might have paid for when embarking on a guided dive, watching you hunt was not one of those things.

I had to smile at this. On our recent Florida trip, all the dive guides did, that I saw, was sit still in the water and watch the divers, and hang onto the dive flag/float line. Watching THEM would have been REALLY boring . . . but what are you doing watching the dive guide? Me, I'm watching the fish . . .

 

[terrylowe]

One of my favorite lines to quote is one from Sabiston's textbook of surgery: "You can put your thumb over the end of a garden hose and stop the water. No vessel in the body contains that kind of pressure." The great thing about bleeding in the extremities is that they are beautifully accessible for direct pressure (which it sounds like the OP was doing). Remember, we are talking about an area of damage the size of a moray's mouth! Even an arterial puncture would a) be unlikely to bleed enough to endanger the patient, and b) be easily controlled with direct pressure. We stick needles in arteries all the time.

I do not expect the average layman to know this, mind you, but a medical professional ought to.

Ahhh...the only reason I replied to the "venous, arterial, capillary" deal was because he looked like he was "piling on". I have bled underwater. When I saw that green cloud I didn't think to myself..."gee...wonder if that is venous, arterial or capillary"? I just put pressure on it.

I can empathize somewhat with the op though. If I were bitten by a snake, all rational thought would evaporate. I wouldn't care if it was poisonous or not, live, dead or rubber. I would freak. For some reason, I don't get the "willy's" as badly with eels.

 

[Bratface]

Dandy Don, here is the link concerning lionfish testing positive for ciguatera (fish poisoning) in the caribbean.

Lionfish and Ciguatera, the Facts have Changed | The CORE Foundation


WHAT IS CIGUATERA?

Ciguatera is a unique type of food poisoning caused by the consumption of marine species that harbor natural toxins originating in certain tropical waters. These species and locations are linked by a food chain, which generates and accumulates a heat-resistant, acid-stable collection of toxic substances known as ciguatoxin. The initial culprits are certain species of microplankton or dinoflagellates that form the toxins that higher-order predators and man consume. These natural toxins can concentrate as they move up the food chain, but their adverse effects appear limited to man.

WHERE DOES CIGUATERA OCCUR?

Ciguatera occurs in marine waters near tropical reefs. The common boundaries referenced are for tropical reef waters between latitudes 35° south and north. Within these areas the occurrence is unpredictable and patchy, both in distribution and time. The majority of reefs are not ciguatoxic and outbreaks are usually localized. Thus, knowledge of the ciguatoxic areas or reefs is usually based on the local experience of fishermen and consumers.

Ciguatera should be a consideration for people travelling to Caribbean areas. Based on seafood origins, primary areas of occurrence for the United States are Hawaii, Guam and Puerto Rico where fish from tropical sources are consumed.

WHICH SEAFOODS CAN BE CIGUATOXIC?

Potentially any tropical marine fish participating in a food chain with ciguatoxin could become ciguatoxic, but documented illnesses and some recent analyses indicate certain fish are more suspect. In the Caribbean region, the fish with the worst reputation are amberjacks and other jacks, moray eels, and barracuda. Fish with questionable reputations are hogfish, scorpion fishes, certain tiggerfish, and certain snapper and groupers.

Unfortunately, the usefulness of a list of ciguatoxic fish is questionable because of the diversity of fish species and the variety of names used. For example, local fisherman may refer to a variety of fish as "jacks" or "snappers" when they are actually a mackerel, wrasse or other species. Certain species of snapper and grouper are not a risk for ciguatera, yet their popular reputation suffers because they are misidentified.

AND CHUCKITAIL, while your Jupiter, FL lionfish may be safe to eat, it is not true for all lionfish in the caribbean.

QUOTE=Chuckitall;5770828]My buddy who invented the Liontamer to kill Lionfish, last Sat fed 100 people LF during an important fund raiser for the reefs. This occurred in Jupiter and nobody got sick or died. Give it a break, LF are as healthy to eat as any other reef fish.[/QUOTE]

 

[Bratface]

And more information posted on Facebook

Death to Lionfish
CIGUATERA UPDATE #1: There is an ongoing Center for Disease Control, FDA Gulf Coast Seafood Lab, U of Florida, U of Maryland and Florida State project looking at climate and reef aspects of ciguatera fish poisoning. Results are just starting to emerge. For example, 4/7 fish tested in the USVI had evidence of ciguatoxins. However, there are no results that suggest lionfish are ciguatoxic everywhere.
10 hours ago · 6 · Like ·

Death to Lionfish
CIGUATERA UPDATE #2. The best advice is to use the precautionary principle. If groupers in your area are known to be ciguatoxic, then be cautious about eating lionfish. If ciguatera is not a problem in your area, then lionfish are probably fine. Be cautious and adapative in how you approach eating lionfish, based on new information as it emerges. Lots of people are eating lionfish in many places - without problems.
10 hours ago · 37 · Like ·

 

[Zieg]

And like DD & Chuckitall, I hunt and had 3 eel bites and 4 lionfish stings in the last year, you won't like our heart pounding dive area.

Wow, I'm a hunter also, been hunting since I first got into the water, been bit twice by eels, managed to mangle fingers quite often, but 3 EEL BITES AND 4 LIONFISH STINGS in the last year? Maybe you should re-examine your hunting techniques.

 

[vladimir]

If the eel was close enough to bite you, then maybe you should address the question of why you were too close to the reef if the eel could reach you and not 20 feet above with other divers inbetween you and the eel?

Are you suggesting that the safe way to conduct a dive is to keep 20 feet and other divers between you and the reef and any eels that might inhabit it? It might be a marginally safer dive strategy, I guess, but it sort of defeats the purpose of diving, doesn't it? I must be misunderstanding you.

 

[annieols]

how did your bite occur, out of curiosity... did the eel come form out of a hole to attack you? were you touching a coral near its hole? i have seen aggressive eels, and am just curious how your actual bite occured...

 

[annieols]

What should be done with a lionfish after it is speared? the PADI Lionfiah Awareness and Elimination course suggests safely removing it from your spear and leaving it on the reef, or collecting it to take to a local research station or to enjoy as a post dive snack. Lionfish should not be fed to local wild life.

I have found the best way to collect is to take a large plastic jar (think commercial sized, from a restaurant for ex), cut a small section out of the side of the lid. When you have a fish on the spear, put the fish (still on spear) in the jar, slide the lid on (the hole should go around the spear) and secure it. Then simply pull the spear out leaving the fish in the jar.

I think it is unfortunate that you go bit by an eel, although things could have been much worse (my friend matt is the one who had to have his toe surgically implanted after a large morey confused his finger with a hot dog). i think to place full blame on the DM is a little short sighted, and to poke fun at a lionfish specialty is simply out of line with your argument--- you seem to be unhappy with how the DM you dove with handled the situation himself, perhaps he could have benifited from some proper training? although, since i created the current PADI Lionfish Awareness and Elimination specialty i could be a little biased, personally!

Divers have a wide range of expectaions and necessities from a DM, and DMs should always take this into consideration. Personally, i dont think DMs should be eliminating LF on regular led -dives, because you never know what will happen to your divers, and because some divers just dont want to see it. however, if this is common practice in cozumel then divers should make some adjustments to their expectations; was this the first dive with this DM? if yes, did the dm ask permission to spear or mention it in a breifing? what was your response if he did? If not the first dive, did you have a problem in previous dives with the eliminating, or did you enjoy the show? did you ask the DM not to practice elimination with you in the future dives?

i would like to hear how your actual bite occured to hear the story about the bite.. was it following you, harassing you, out of no where?

 

[Karibelle]

I had to smile at this. On our recent Florida trip, all the dive guides did, that I saw, was sit still in the water and watch the divers, and hang onto the dive flag/float line. Watching THEM would have been REALLY boring . . . but what are you doing watching the dive guide? Me, I'm watching the fish . . .

That was me that you were quoting. And yes, I do find it boring when the briefing says "stay behind the guide" and then the guide is preoccupied hunting. On a drift dive, what I'm thinking is "MOVE ALONG." No point in making me sit against the current waiting for you to catch your fish. GUIDE THE DIVE. This is Cozumel, not Florida.

My two cents.