Dutch Springs - First Impressions

[doctormike]

Very interesting thread. I am new to this board and diving (again). In my mind I was picturing a closeness of diving folks but I see that a message board is a message board is a message board. Someone posts their OPINION and they get blasted. Seems like this happens on every single board out there.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, even when you are responding to someone else's opinion BUT the unnecessary personal attacks are a real downer. I am surprised at the adolescent outbursts in a community that I thought was a bit more professional due to the importance of safety and teamwork.

Yeah, I'm disappointed. My opinion of course.

Hmmm... A bit of a zombie thread, but I'll take a stab at it...

Every single post in every forum is an opinion. I'm not sure what rises to the level of blasting, or adolescent outbursts, but certainly there are some fairly spirited defenses of DS by the local crowd.

DS is home for a lot of the local diving community in the northeast, and it is a place where good friends have met and learned together over many years. Naturally, a lot of us have developed an attachment to the place. Of course there are downsides to diving in a quarry, but many of us think that it is terrific (thanks for the summary, Trace!). As far the prices, I just don't see that $35 for a day in a well maintained, clean park with a rescue team on standby is so far out of line when compared to $90 for a ride to a local wreck.

Sorry to say, but I really think that the OP was trolling a bit with this post. Her experience with DS was a walk around the park. So to post a long dissertation about all of the problems that she had with the place despite never having dived here, suggest to me an attempt to stir up a response from the locals.

"First thing we noticed, and couldn't believe, were the prices!"
"shocking territorial behavior"
"shocking to see large groups of divers ... totally blocking them from use by any other divers! Not very courteous if you ask me, let alone professional"
"The staff on hand ... were lacking in pleasantry"
"Many people [cycling] through the water must have a negative effect on both the visibility and the aquatic life that one wishes to appreciate while diving"

I'm sorry if I have misunderstood the OP, and I'm sorry that she felt that the $19 was too much for admission. DS has that lower price for non-divers. If it was much lower the place would probably be overrun with kids looking for a cheap pool to beat the heat. The $19 fee is primarily aimed at the non diving family of people who are using the facility for it's primary purpose (diving), I assume.

I guess it's sort of like going to a sports discussion board and posting "Goodness, the Yankees seem to be poor entertainment. The prices at the stadium are shockingly high, and I while I haven't seen them play, I can't imagine that they are any good. Can someone tell me the positive aspects of that team?"

 

[lowviz]

...............Could someone please tell me what the positive points of this place would be?

Hello again,
Per previous experience, I believe that you are someone who speaks extremely directly and only wants the OP question answered. Here goes:

IF THE OCEAN ISN'T BEHAVING:

As previously stated, the viz at Dutch is exceptional. see attached image I took of an NEDEG diver.

It is a great place to meet friends and spend the day diving.

The staff is nowhere near as annoying as they used to be.

Once you get underwater it is big enough that you are quite alone.

I don't always like the crowds and commotion, so I go to Willow a lot, off topic, sorry.

 

[ZenDiver.3D]

I hope the examples below aren't part of your New York group. If so, I am sorry for you...

These kinds of statements make you come off as snide and condescending.

Steve,

You are off the mark on this one. I think she was disappointed that an admission was charged to do a surface checkout of the facilities and by the weekend crowds.

She has not dived Dutch and was asking those of us who do, what we liked about it. She got some good responses and a few negative ones about her spending habits. She was rightfully put off by this. I probably would be too.

I hope she and her husband will give Dutch a try.

Did you read the overwhelming negative statements to begin with? The OP had two neutral statements. Otherwise every single thing was a put down. And Then she asks others to defend it.

If that's a strong opinion, I shudder to imagine what you would actually consider rude and improper.

Even more disturbing is that you admit to encouraging such behavior.

That's just my opinion.

You seem to think that you have the right to expect people to bow down to your ideas and not defend something you initially attack, and then ask a question about. I happen to know these people and respect them. They are loyal, intelligent, and friendly to honestly good hearted people. You, I neither know, nor care to be around based on the attitude shown. You would have gotten many more polite responses if you had not bashed first.

Hmmm... A bit of a zombie thread, but I'll take a stab at it...

Sorry to say, but I really think that the OP was trolling a bit with this post. Her experience with DS was a walk around the park. So to post a long dissertation about all of the problems that she had with the place despite never having dived here, suggest to me an attempt to stir up a response from the locals.

"First thing we noticed, and couldn't believe, were the prices!"
"shocking territorial behavior"
"shocking to see large groups of divers ... totally blocking them from use by any other divers! Not very courteous if you ask me, let alone professional"
"The staff on hand ... were lacking in pleasantry"
"Many people [cycling] through the water must have a negative effect on both the visibility and the aquatic life that one wishes to appreciate while diving"

I'm sorry if I have misunderstood the OP, and I'm sorry that she felt that the $19 was too much for admission. DS has that lower price for non-divers. If it was much lower the place would probably be overrun with kids looking for a cheap pool to beat the heat. The $19 fee is primarily aimed at the non diving family of people who are using the facility for it's primary purpose (diving), I assume.

I guess it's sort of like going to a sports discussion board and posting "Goodness, the Yankees seem to be poor entertainment. The prices at the stadium are shockingly high, and I while I haven't seen them play, I can't imagine that they are any good. Can someone tell me the positive aspects of that team?"

Yup. Sometimes they just ask for it, and then seem surprised at the inevitable responses.

 

[lowviz]

ZenDiver.3D: Congratulations on your new avatar. I truly never know what to expect from you! And I consider myself hard to surprise.

This is way off-topic but who cares, this thread melted down long ago. From several PM's she shared, BlondMermaid is not nearly as prickly as she comes across in this thread. Acually, quite interesting. Unfortunately, I can't share anything in public, they were PM's and I respect the "Personal" part of PM. Lots of room in SB for someone with a "strong personality", -as if there aren't any others...

However, a line was crossed. Based solely on BlondMermaid's public posts, I have to side with the ragged collection of posters that voiced an objection. One side or the other, no wusses.

BlondMermaid: So why don't you let us know a bit more about yourself and what you do for a living? May help to define you.
lowviz

 

[doctormike]

THIS should convince anyone that Dutch Springs ROCKS..! Turn up the volume...

 

[TravisD]

Wife and I went to DS last week (Wed/Thu) and had a great time. It would be nice if there was a mid-week price break, but just not having any crowds to deal with made it worth the trip. Mid-week meant we could park by our picnic table both days. The staff member on duty in our area both days (Greg) was absolutely awesome - extremely helpful incuding pointing us to a covered site we could use, and made sure that our tanks got filled before we left so we didn't have to wait the next morning. He also helped us out with finding some of the features we wanted to see.

We haven't made the leap yet to diving the mid-atlantic, so local quarries are our usual habitat. While we generally stick to our local mudhole (being 5-10 minutes away has the effect of canceling out some of the shortcomings), Dutch is worth it to us to make a trip up once a year or so.

 

[NC Wreck Diver]

Well, I didn't read all the posts, but here is my opinion. Dutch Springs is the best quarry to go to in the Northeast. It has the best vis (except the student side - but they need to learn too). It does get crowded, but that is why we get there early. I was just there yesterday, stayed to opening to closing, and did 5 great dives on Nitrox doubles.

We save a lot of money since we dive there a lot, and buy the season pass. I was certified there in 1985 and it was $6.00 admission. But, they have put a lot of money in from their investors, made it a real family orientatied place, and did a great job. When I started there, it was just two circus trailers for changing and porti-potties. Now there are consessions, A/C changing rooms, bathrooms, hot showers, and as you mentioned, camping, if you are so inclined. Night dives too. So all in all, it's a great place. I grill most of the time, so I have not had their food. I hear it's not the best, but that is just opinions. Being a pitmaster, purchased food is a hard act to follow

I live 45 minutes from the park (when Musikfest isn't in Bethlehem!), so it's hard not to go there when we are not boat diving. It's more crowded (as far as gear goes) since there is room to spread out. But, people should not hog tables. If you ask nicely, most everyone will share or give up a table.

I've been to most quarries in the area, and Dutch is best. I see more out of state licence plates there than ones from Pennsylvania.

 

[a22shady]

THIS should convince anyone that Dutch Springs ROCKS..! Turn up the volume...

Nice Videos

TravisD:I also met Greg and talk with him he is a great guy and very helpful like most of the staff

 

[NC Wreck Diver]

Very interesting thread. I am new to this board and diving (again). In my mind I was picturing a closeness of diving folks but I see that a message board is a message board is a message board. Someone posts their OPINION and they get blasted. Seems like this happens on every single board out there.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, even when you are responding to someone else's opinion BUT the unnecessary personal attacks are a real downer. I am surprised at the adolescent outbursts in a community that I thought was a bit more professional due to the importance of safety and teamwork.

Yeah, I'm disappointed. My opinion of course.

Your opinion counts, just like BlondMermaid's............and these are just our opinions. It's just a Scuba Diving Forum. Nothing is going to Congress..........like that matters.

 

[NC Wreck Diver]

THIS should convince anyone that Dutch Springs ROCKS..! Turn up the volume...

Very Cool..........................