DumpsterDiver emergency ascent from 180'

[HantsDiver]

Yes for sure, but this is on top of the certification process. You can ask to undertake the next step, but if your peers don't think you're ready for it, they won't teach you - but they will engage in steps for you to meet the required standard to start.

As to the 50m qualification. First you need to complete Dive leader (DM) by which time you will have learnt and carried out planned deco dives under training. then you have to make 3 depth progression dives. Again if you're not ready/wrong attitude you won't get to carry out the dive.

Not all BSAC training is done in a club environment.

You can pay money to do the dives. And bsac are not known for being either the best of the safest divers either. 50m on a 15l and a 3l pony is very common for both their students and their instructors.

There are other issues with the club environment which I'm not going to go into here as it's well off topic. But the idea they produce the best divers is laughable.

 

[Diving Dubai]

But the idea they produce the best divers is laughable.

I don't believe that I said anywhere that they produced the best divers.

You know yourself it's not the organisation but the instructor.

Even that can count for nought, someoen could be given the very best training by the very best instructor, but it they choose not to apply what they've learnt, it can't be blamed on the instructor

 

[dmaziuk]

I don't believe that I said anywhere that they produced the best divers.

However, I believe you're correct in that by the time you get the 50m cert you're supposed to be told much more about deco theory and gas planning that you'd expect from a, say, PADI "recreational" "advanced" OW course. (Which is not the same thing as knowing about deco theory and/or planning gas properly, of course.) IIRC the phrase I was commenting on included "no technical training" and this is where we can start spitting hairs.

But anyway, my comment was mostly meant as be careful with your rhetorical questions for they may get answered sense.

 

[CuzzA]

I think this thread has turned to being very educational. A little bit of everything.

To add to that I was thinking about what else DD could have done if he had a deco ceiling. I thought it would be prudent to share here, though it would require some significant skill to pull off mid-water and being a free diver would certainly help as the technique would require holding your breath.

So, since he had a redundant reg with him on his pony and assuming he still had enough back gas he could have swapped regs, purged the water from the pony reg now on his back gas and finished any deco.

Just thought I'd mention it since it hasn't come up yet. I know the obvious answer is carry enough redundant gas, so spare us that point.

 

[2airishuman]

To add to that I was thinking about what else DD could have done if he had a deco ceiling. I thought it would be prudent to share here, though it would require some significant skill to pull off mid-water and being a free diver would certainly help as the technique would require holding your breath.

So, since he had a redundant reg with him on his pony and assuming he still had enough back gas he could have swapped regs, purged the water from the pony reg now on his back gas and finished any deco.

Let me see if I've got this straight.

So, the idea is that, mid-water but with the benefit of the line on the bag he had shot, he could have removed his BC and turned it around to get access to the two back-mounted cylinders. Then, while holding the line and the BC in one hand, he could have removed the failed 1st stage from the valve of his primary cylinder with the other, closed the valve on the pony cylinder, breathed in sufficiently to release the pressure, then removed the 1st stage from the valve of the pony cylinder, installed it on the valve of the primary cylinder, opened the valve, purged the reg. While holding his breath. With one hand. Then completed deco.

I find it far-fetched.

I suppose yoke valves would be an advantage over DIN valves if you were going to try it.

 

[stuartv]

Let me see if I've got this straight.

So, the idea is that, mid-water but with the benefit of the line on the bag he had shot, he could have removed his BC and turned it around to get access to the two back-mounted cylinders. Then, while holding the line and the BC in one hand, he could have removed the failed 1st stage from the valve of his primary cylinder with the other, closed the valve on the pony cylinder, breathed in sufficiently to release the pressure, then removed the 1st stage from the valve of the pony cylinder, installed it on the valve of the primary cylinder, opened the valve, purged the reg. While holding his breath. With one hand. Then completed deco.

I find it far-fetched.

I suppose yoke valves would be an advantage over DIN valves if you were going to try it.

That's what I got. Except, someone with decent buoyancy control should not have to hold onto their reel. One of my regular dive buddies frequently shoots a bag and then just lets the reel hang in the water in front of him when he's holding a stop. The bag will flop over on the surface, but, in this case, so what?

If DD did actually turn off the valve on his main tank after the reg blew, then this seems like something that someone with DD's skills should be able to do without too much difficulty. But, I'm not at all clear that he did that. I thought I picked up somewhere in this thread that he breathed it until it ran out and then switched to his pony.

 

[CuzzA]

I know one person who has told me they did it. Though I believe he may have had a third tank to breathe off which makes it easier, I believe all 3 tanks were backmounted.

I don't doubt he can pull it off. Whether he would of thought to do it is another story. He's illustrated he can multitask very well.

As Stuart pointed out though, is there enough gas? In this incident he didn't switch to his pony until he was at 70ft. So probably not.

Like I said, in theory it could be done.

 

[northernone]

I know one person who has told me they did it. Though I believe he may have had a third tank to breathe off which makes it easier, I believe all 3 tanks were backmounted.

I don't doubt he can pull it off. Whether he would of thought to do it is another story. He's illustrated he can multitask very well.

As Stuart pointed out though, is there enough gas? In this incident he didn't switch to his pony until he was at 70ft. So probably not.

Like I said, in theory it could be done.

I'll reference the 'swapping regs underwater' thread to agree in practice it has been done. But I can think of easier ways of having more gas...
Cameron

 

[oldschoolto]

This is why I like to hang a deco bottle on a down line at 10 - 15 feet... Having a cylinder of gas waiting for you is a really good feeling....

Jim....

 

[stuartv]

I know one person who has told me they did it. Though I believe he may have had a third tank to breathe off which makes it easier, I believe all 3 tanks were backmounted.

I don't doubt he can pull it off. Whether he would of thought to do it is another story. He's illustrated he can multitask very well.

As Stuart pointed out though, is there enough gas? In this incident he didn't switch to his pony until he was at 70ft. So probably not.

Like I said, in theory it could be done.

Based on my training for dealing with failures in doubles, in the situation he was in, I believe I would have shut down the valve immediately, breathed the reg down, and switched to the pony (readying the pony reg while breathing down the primary).

You could stay down a long time breathing off a nearly full AL80 by feathering the valve, if you had to, without doing all that reg switching. But, once you let all the gas go, it's gone....

Based on the other day when I splashed in the pool during an OW class and discovered that I had turned my tank off before we moved from the shallow end to the deep end and I forgot to turn it back on, I do believe I could turn that single tank valve if I had to... Thank goodness I splashed last and behind all the students and nobody noticed.