Do you/would you fly with an 19hr surface interval?

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I wouldn't have a problem with it at all. 30 foot dives involve minimal nitrogen accumulation at best of times, and if you are not completely de-saturated after 19 hours, you will be so close as makes no difference.

Plus remember that the DCS is not a black/white proposition. It is a long gradient of darkening grey. You would be extraordinarily unlucky to get any DCS symptoms after a series of very shallow dives and a 19 hour SI, but if you did, you would be extraordinarily unlucky to suffer more than some light skin bends and, at worst, a little joint discomfort.
 
Brian2828: get out your table or dive computer, plan all the dives and see where your residual nitrogen is going to be at the end. Look at your final pressure group. When on vacation, I do not dive on the last day. If you take the advice of some people who push the limits and you get DCS, ask them if they will cover the thousands of dollars of treatment. Commercial aircraft are pressurized to apps 8000ft when at altitude. Do what you know is right based on the training you have received from your INSTRUCTORS.
 
Brian2828: get out your table or dive computer, plan all the dives and see where your residual nitrogen is going to be at the end. Look at your final pressure group.

Unfortunately, the dive plan outline appears to be well beyond what normal (Recreational) tables - - even some of the older ones - - will provide guidance for.

For example, 18hrs BT in 3 days is 6hrs/day of bottom time, and as per one old table that I happen to have handy (old PADI, IIRC, copy of NAVY), the highest bottom time value on the table for 30fsw is 310 minutes = 5.16 hours (FYI, this returns a Group "L"). Similarly, the DCIEM model (1992) has a max no-stop bottom time of 300 minutes @ 30ft, and Bassett says 220 minutes max. And surely, while any diver would have some RN Group crediting from SI's, the question isn't if he will go "Off Table", but merely when that will occur, as per each of these example Tables' models.

Even here, it doesn't necessarily mean that the diver's at risk - - just that he's beyond the point where the model has had sufficient validation with which to have published specific NDL (or Deco) guidelines.


When on vacation, I do not dive on the last day.

Unfortunately, there's so many variables in dive profiles that even DAN (who did suggest a 24 hour SI some years ago) has revised their current guidance of 12 / 18 hours being dependant on insight on just what kind of dive profiles were being performed.

FWIW, a far more common 'dive travel' scenario when assessing the comparative risk question for flying-after-diving is if one should perform a short/deep "bounce" dive profile or a long, shallow ("take it easy on my last dive day") profile: the answer resides in the details of the deco theory's math, which may very well be non-intuitive.

Unfortunately, given the current scope of mainstream recreational dive education on deco theory, I'm afraid that the OP's question is simply out of its league, and similarly, some (if not most?) of the deco models being employed today are also inadequate because many models simply didn't undergo sufficient validatation.

The simplest answer is to suggest "Don't Dive This Profile", of course, but that's already obvious and known, and it does not really serve to answer the underlying question of the objective assessment of the potential risks. Of course, this is multivariate and there's other risk levers that can be pulled, so if we were to look at the question more holisticaly, the two things that IMO would probably be more significant than the 18 hour (vs +X hours longer) SI to flight home question is if we've adequately managed the risks of: (1) the diver remaining sufficiently rested & hydrated during these three days, and (2) if the diver has been specifically tested and confirmed to not have a PFO.


-hh
 
Do what you know is right based on the training you have received from your INSTRUCTORS.

That's probably an appropriate answer for the Basic Scuba Discussions forum.

In the Advanced Scuba Discussion forum, people would probably like more information on the science behind the recommendations (read the post above by -hh, for example) than to just be told to follow what their instructors were told to follow...
 
I typically give myself 18 hours after a multi-day, 2-4 dive-per-day trip, per what I understand are DAN's recommendations. My computer usually agrees, with the "no fly" icon disappearing at about that time. This means that I might do several dives (generally in the 60-90 feet range) per day except that sometimes on the penultimate day I might end my diving after a deep morning dive and not dive in the afternoon. That generally gives me 18-24 hours before my flight on the last day. I wouldn't hesitate to give myself "only" 18 hours if my last few dives were not especially deep or long.

But it seems to me that making a decision by taking a poll of what others would do is not the best way to make that decision. I follow DAN's guidelines, which I have to believe are based on the available data, and if I prove to be an outlier data point and get bent at some point, well, that's the way it goes.
 
For those of you that have a problem with my post. I am not telling anybody what to do, only making a suggestion. If you want to dive any number of hours before flying because you are smarter than the table, computer, DAN, or you think you are just immune to any repercussions go ahead. I will be interested to read your post after you recover from DCS or whatever stupid ailment you had. I have been teaching for a few years so if you want to get into a discussion of dive theory and decompression models we can do that in a different thread. I simply stated that the op should refer back to his training and do what he knows to be right, instead of pushing the limits for one more dive and increasing his risk of injury.

See you in the ER
 
For those of you that have a problem with my post. I am not telling anybody what to do, only making a suggestion. If you want to dive any number of hours before flying because you are smarter than the table, computer, DAN, or you think you are just immune to any repercussions go ahead. I will be interested to read your post after you recover from DCS or whatever stupid ailment you had. I have been teaching for a few years so if you want to get into a discussion of dive theory and decompression models we can do that in a different thread. I simply stated that the op should refer back to his training and do what he knows to be right, instead of pushing the limits for one more dive and increasing his risk of injury.

See you in the ER

Maybe an INSTRUCTOR could tell us if 19 hours is pushing the limits in this case - with appropriate references of course. The last I checked, 19 hours was more than 18 hours; but I am not an INSTRUCTOR.

I'd hope to see you in the library.
 
This thread has turned out to be more interesting than I thought it would be. I appreciate those that have responded with thoughtful answers based on various aspects of decompression theory. Those answers are what add to the body of knowledge that many of us seek when we read through posts and allow us to make better decisions in these matters.There is mo magic number where it's completely safe above it and completely dangerous below but rather a murky area of gray. Sure we could err on the side of caution and not dive for 36, 30, or 24 hours or whatever but at some point you need to decide what you are comfortable with. We could also err on the side of caution and never go underwater in the first place but I guess we don't choose that.
 
For those of you that have a problem with my post. I am not telling anybody what to do, only making a suggestion. If you want to dive any number of hours before flying because you are smarter than the table, computer, DAN, or you think you are just immune to any repercussions go ahead. I will be interested to read your post after you recover from DCS or whatever stupid ailment you had. I have been teaching for a few years so if you want to get into a discussion of dive theory and decompression models we can do that in a different thread. I simply stated that the op should refer back to his training and do what he knows to be right, instead of pushing the limits for one more dive and increasing his risk of injury.

Wow, who died and made you forum censor? This is the Advanced Scuba Discussion forum. It's not taboo for people to want to understand the science behind this. And I don't think anybody said they were "immune" to anything. That's just you standing up a strawman to cut off a discussion that (for whatever reason) you are clearly uncomfortable having.

See you in the ER

Nothing like a new guy with an old guy attitude. Sheesh!
 
The DAN study was relatively thorough. It has been a number of years since I looked at it carefully, but as I recall I left it thinking that the 18 hour limit for multiple dives was conservative. Even with the length of time the diver plans to be in the water, if it were I doing the diving, I would follow the 18 hour rule without hesitation. And yes, 19 hours is more than 18 hours.
 

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