Do instructors not like to sell BP/W?

[gcbryan]

...
Neither a BP or jacket BC has an overwhelming advantage for single-tank recreational diving.

A BP/W trades the ability to be stable in any position for extra stability when horizontal. Chocolate or vanilla. It's your choice, but there's no real advantage for either.
...

The first statement may be true to an extent. They are both BC's and both can be used for recreational diving.

The second statement isn't descriptive of the differences between the two or indicative of the reasons one may have for choosing between the two.

You can achieve trim regardless of what BC you use.

Traditional BC's however usually have excess padding requiring additional (unnecessary) weight to offset this.

In most cases your tank will not be nearly as stable with a jacket style BC as with a BP with a crotch strap.

With a jacket style BC you generally end up with useless straps (chest strap) and dangling straps with rings on the ends (shoulder adjustment straps). You get a bunch of plastic buckles, cummerbunds, pockets you can't get to and in general it just doesn't seem like a traditional BC was ever designed by an actual diver.

With a BP/W it's helpful to have pockets on your drysuit but you need them less since you can now attach a backup light to your shoulder harness since it no longer adjusts for each dive. Since you have a useful waist belt rather than a cummerbund you can attach a cutting tool.

It's easy to have less clutter with shorter hose lengths on the inflator hose and with a waist D-ring you can have a shorter SPG hose. One piece webbing and you can adjust and replace anything about the whole system.

With a SS BP you can take weight off your waist. Keeping the tank closer to your body results in a more stable feeling as well.

There's nothing really tech about it. Switching wings isn't really the big feature some make it out to be since most people don't actually switch wings out all that much.

For most people I believe it's just a better system.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

"Experienced" divers don't necessarily use a BP. In fact, some of the most experienced divers I know (including some that started out with a fire-extinguisher tank and diagrams from Popular Mechanics) dive with a SCUBAPro Classic.

I'm not sure why recreational shops don't carry more (any?) BPs. It's probably something mundane, like lower margin, more work and more inventory (lots of wing styles and lifts), however this is just a guess.

Maybe some dive shop owners can step up to the plate (pun intended) with some answers.

Terry

I know there's a very large number of experienced divers using jackets, I know of several myself. But it's also possible that those divers don't spend much time on the net and haven't really given BP/W much thought or haven't been exposed. Maybe the jackets they are using work OK so they just go with it in combo with being associated with a shop that only sells these jackets. But what if they were exposed to different systems and dive shops actually carried more BP/W systems, don't you think there would be a fairly large number of experienced divers currently using jackets that would convert in a heartbeat to a more streamlined and simpler set up like the BP/W?

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I know there's a very large number of experienced divers using jackets, I know of several myself. But it's also possible that those divers don't spend much time on the net and haven't really given BP/W much thought or haven't been exposed. Maybe the jackets they are using work OK so they just go with it in combo with being associated with a shop that only sells these jackets. But what if they were exposed to different systems and dive shops actually carried more BP/W systems, don't you think there would be a fairly large number of experienced divers currently using jackets that would convert in a heartbeat to a more streamlined and simpler set up like the BP/W?

Not necessarily. If the jacket serves their needs, why change?

Many very experienced divers can dive quite well and comfortably with the equipment they own. They're used to it. It serves its purpose. Maybe they even like it.

What does it matter if there is something else that they may (or may not) like better if they're happy with what they're using?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[sabbath999]

I've got a ScubaPro Glide Plus sitting in the closet and am using a Dive Rite BP/W system every weekend.

I am keeping the Glide Plus around simply because I may become a DM to teach digital underwater photography and the shop that I would be working with "encourages" their DM's to dive equipment they sell (and give excellent 'employee' discounts as well... which is good since I like ScubaPro regs).

I basically use two "LDS" shops in different towns, and have gear from both... One is a ScubaPro shop and the other sells ScubaPro, Oceanic and a bunch of different technical companies (Dive Rite, Hollis, OMS to name a few). The one that sells the tech gear has a lot of their DM's using BP/W systems... in fact, we just did a drysuit class and our instructor was in a BP/W.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I've got a ScubaPro Glide Plus sitting in the closet and am using a Dive Rite BP/W system every weekend.

I am keeping the Glide Plus around simply because I may become a DM to teach digital underwater photography and the shop that I would be working with "encourages" their DM's to dive equipment they sell (and give excellent 'employee' discounts as well... which is good since I like ScubaPro regs).

I basically use two "LDS" shops in different towns, and have gear from both... One is a ScubaPro shop and the other sells ScubaPro, Oceanic and a bunch of different technical companies (Dive Rite, Hollis, OMS to name a few). The one that sells the tech gear has a lot of their DM's using BP/W systems... in fact, we just did a drysuit class and our instructor was in a BP/W.

... and if you are going to be working with classes, it helps to have a separate set of gear for the pool ... chlorine does terrible things to dive equipment, and you'd want to minimize the amount of time your "regular" gear gets used in a pool. It also helps to have something that is like what the students are using, for skills demos ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Web Monkey]

I do object to the tired, weak argument that BC's must be "good" simply because the majority of divers use one.

Whatever people are happy with is by definition "good" for that person. I went diving with a guy who's idea of "SCUBA equipment" consisted of a small steel tank, a reg, some webbing and a wetsuit that looked like it was made out of old tire patches. No BC, plate or wing, and he was just fine with it.

It was "good" for him.

Terry

 

[cool_hardware52]

Whatever people are happy with is by definition "good" for that person. I went diving with a guy who's idea of "SCUBA equipment" consisted of a small steel tank, a reg, some webbing and a wetsuit that looked like it was made out of old tire patches. No BC, plate or wing, and he was just fine with it.

It was "good" for him.

Terry

Ignorance is bliss

Tobin

 

[Teamcasa]

Ignorance is bliss

Tobin

Isn't diving supposed to be blissful? If the diver is quite happy and comfortable diving some reef in the Caribbean who cares?

 

[cool_hardware52]

Isn't diving supposed to be blissful? If the diver is quite happy and comfortable diving some reef in the Caribbean who cares?

Indeed. I'm not debating that at all.

OTOH The concept of a perfect market requires informed buyers and sellers.

Tobin

 

[RAWalker]

As usual you have again missed my point.

Show me one time where I've told any diver that they cannot or should not use what they find best for them.

If you want to use 45 lbs bungeed wings and complex multi buckled harnesses etc. you have every right to do so.

OTOH if you choose to promote such choices to others you need to be able to defend them.

I do object to the tired, weak argument that BC's must be "good" simply because the majority of divers use one.

Tobin

Sorry you are missing the point it's choices that fit the individual.

You do it each and every time a diver brings up a choice such as a 45# bungeed wing or harness with a shoulder release.
Suggesting it to another diver is simply giving them an alternative that may or may not suit their needs.
A harness with shoulder releases gives them an alternative that may allow them to feel more comfortable and still allow them to experience some of the other characterisitc that lead them to consider a BP&W.

Maybe the arguement isn't so tired or weak. Granted there are products from each catagory that simply aren't well engineered or are poorly manufacturerd. But with BC's making up the lions share of the market there are also many that are excellent products.
Nearly all of these use releases.
The majority of these have lift capacities of 30# or greater and are designed for divers that dive under diverse conditions.
The majority of divers want a single BCD that can handle that diversity.
It is only a small group of divers that dive more frequently and are willing to narrow down the scope of a dive rig and purchase multiple configurations.
Questions that divers should ask when considering any BCD product is why are the majority of BC's designed with the lift capacities of 30# or greater and why they use shoulder releases.