Diver Death in Cayman

[pilot fish]

Were you over-exerting while you were at 97 ft? While it is not impossible to be narc'd at 97 ft, it is not that common, I'm told. Were you anxious, breathing shallowly and rapidly? Did it feel as if you could not get enough air from your reg?

Being narc's at 72 ft is, I think, unusual. I would ask some diver pro,[ thal, can you answer here? ], about this. it could be an inner ear thing? I was told that when I felt narc'd at 55 ft on a night dive.

First off, thank you Fosterboxermom for your courage in sharing the facts from this horrible accident with us. I know I've learned a bit and it brings back a lot of memories from my first dives in the Carribean.
My question is regarding the reef. Was the entire topography of the dive a slope or was it flat where you were moored? From what I gathered, you all went in one direction until it was a sharp slope and then turned left. Is that correct? And then after making the turn, the diver was noticed to be missing? I know you posted his depth at 14 min so, were you able to make a logical conclusion that he knew you made a turn? I would venture to guess that he would have been at the back of the pack for no one to have noticed him leave the group? As others have brought up being narced, I wonder how much that played into it. That he was feeling the effects and didn't recognize his depth or losing the group until too late.
As far as dark narc....as a noob I was in that position once and I was fortunate to have been with other very experienced divers keeping an eye out for me. I was definately a trust me diver. I thought it would be ok to follow all of the experienced divers to 90 ft. It was the first time I broke my training limits and have never done so again. There is no doubt in my mind that had I not been with someone close by, that dive would have resulted in my fatality. I was always told up until that point that being narced was like being drunk....doing silly things. Well, for me on that dive, it was exactly how Pilot Fish described....very bad. After my incident, I was told dark narc did not exist and I could not have been narced at 87ft. The next dive I did we took it easy and I found myself experiencing symptoms at 72 ft.
Point being, training is key and everyone's body is different. In fact, every day is a new day and we must always be aware of how we are feeling physically.
I can't remember how many dives your friend had but, I would venture to guess that his issues started long before he hit his mark of 100ft.
Again, I am sorry this happened to you new found dive friend. It is a very sad reminder at how important our OW training is.

 

[fosterboxermom]

POSTED BY TIGRR
My question is regarding the reef. Was the entire topography of the dive a slope or was it flat where you were moored? From what I gathered, you all went in one direction until it was a sharp slope and then turned left. Is that correct? And then after making the turn, the diver was noticed to be missing? I know you posted his depth at 14 min so, were you able to make a logical conclusion that he knew you made a turn? I would venture to guess that he would have been at the back of the pack for no one to have noticed him leave the group? As others have brought up being narced, I wonder how much that played into it. That he was feeling the effects and didn't recognize his depth or losing the group until too late.

Tigrr, Yes you are correct from what I can recall, it was flat where we moored and then it took a more sharp drop as we turned left (this is according to my husband he was closer to the bottom than I was.) It was just before the turn when we noticed the diver missing. Speculation is he didn't make the turn.

 

[pilot fish]

No skin off my back. I really have no business posting in this thread (as far as it goes) as I have (nor desire, for that matter) zero experience as a dive professional.

thal mixed you up with someone else. An honest mistake

You have every right to post in this thread, just like the rest of us.

 

[pilot fish]

If it does not get linked, you can find it on YouTube. do a saerch under Scuba and Fatality. The video is chilling.

thanks. saw it. very scary:depressed:

 

[pilot fish]

His cert that allows him to lead a dive safely, which he did not do. He should not be able to ever lead a dive again.:depressed:

The fact that THIS dive was not planned by the shop but left up to this unsafe DM indicates what to you? You think every boat dive is that planned in advance? Where do you dive? Have you ever been on a boat where the Capt and DM ask divers where THEY would like to dive that day?

What Cert?

Which agency was he representing? Get a grip
DiveMaster isn't a particluar cert from one agency.

I've just looked back to find the post from the OP about going into the shop and signing up for the dives. Couldn't find it, it seems to have dissapeared.

Do you really believe that a boat trip to a dive site isn't planned. Crap.
On a livaboard yeah, perhaps: But a trip with 7 divers, one who has mentioned how he wants to dive beyond his training and experience and go deeper. Mmmmm

 

[fosterboxermom]

No skin off my back. I really have no business posting in this thread (as far as it goes) as I have (nor desire, for that matter) zero experience as a dive professional.

Blackwood, You have more training than I have. And you have every business being here as anyone else does. We are all here to learn from this and talk and make mistakes and corrections. Lord knows I have made mine and the board has been kind to me for all of the good and bad. Thank you for your consideration of my feelings.

 

[GaryLee]

His cert that allows him to lead a dive safely, which he did not do. He should not be able to ever lead a dive again.:depressed:

The fact that THIS dive was not planned by the shop but left up to this unsafe DM indicates what to you? You think every boat dive is that planned in advance? Where do you dive? Have you ever been on a boat where the Capt and DM ask divers where THEY would like to dive that day?

Bless you PilotFish
I can be a dive guide with no qualification. I guess I just need to know the site.
However if I did have a cerification it has nothing whatsoever to do with my job as a Dive Guide, What one do I need to be a Dive Guide and for the general public to call me a diveMaster (wrongly of course). As long as I meet the laws of the land then ther e is no organisation to govern my qualifications.. Now of course Dive guides will do their best to accomodate divers that want to do certain dives but where does it end.?

 

[tiggrr]

Were you over-exerting while you were at 97 ft? While it is not impossible to be narc'd at 97 ft, it is not that common, I'm told. Were you anxious, breathing shallowly and rapidly? Did it feel as if you could not get enough air from your reg?

Being narc's at 72 ft is, I think, unusual. I would ask some diver pro,[ thal, can you answer here? ], about this. it could be an inner ear thing? I was told that when I felt narc'd at 55 ft on a night dive.

I was over-exerting like a maniac which brought it on very fast. I was at 87 ft not 97. I also was unable to figure out how to work my inflator hose and could not read my gauges until I reached between 60-65 ft. The numbers on my computer made no sense at all.

The next day on a slope at 72 ft I experienced the same symptoms of not being able to work my gauges and read my computer. I ascended a few feet and could read them again. I was not over-exerting on this dive and did not feel the extreme sense of panic but, felt a little stressed as the symptoms came on.

I did 5 more dives that week (all shallow above 60) with no issues. I've had 250+ since and I do still notice being narced at 90+ but, it is slight and since I know what it is now, have no issue with it. Proper weighting/buoyancy and descending too fast were the main problem with those dives.

 

[GaryLee]

His cert that allows him to lead a dive safely, which he did not do. He should not be able to ever lead a dive again.:depressed:

The fact that THIS dive was not planned by the shop but left up to this unsafe DM indicates what to you? You think every boat dive is that planned in advance? Where do you dive? Have you ever been on a boat where the Capt and DM ask divers where THEY would like to dive that day?

So you've dived with Divers Down
Walked into the shop
Asked to dive
Been given two, not one but two dives to make sure you were OK to dive
then taken on a standard Cayman Dive.
THe shop telling you what the dive is you;ll be doing when you ask

Guess what,
I Have
and
yes I might make changes to the way things are done from a non professional point of view but I guarantee you.
This particular incident will not have any legal ramifications on the dive centre involved.

 

[pilot fish]

Bless you PilotFish
I can be a dive guide with no qualification. I guess I just need to know the site.
However if I did have a cerification it has nothing whatsoever to do with my job as a Dive Guide, What one do I need to be a Dive Guide and for the general public to call me a diveMaster (wrongly of course). As long as I meet the laws of the land then ther e is no organisation to govern my qualifications.. Now of course Dive guides will do their best to accomodate divers that want to do certain dives but where does it end.?

You told me what I needed to know that clarifies your position.